Loss of an Adult Child

[sadmomm]

Susahnnah I liked the coments the kids made about the ashes. How dear... Bet it made you sad though. I know where I want to go right in the box with my son. His dad said he will spread them in California. I hope he keeps them so I can go in there with him. As all of us I know we wish it had been us not them..

Merry christmas to you

Jd's Mom I am so sorry. We are all here crying with you .. And I think alot else changes. Ones whole world thoughts future. Anxiety is probably high and sleeplessness.. inherent.. I am so sorry. I don't know why they were taken so young.

Dee Your poem hit home. thanks very lovely very real.

carrie Morgans mom

[Guest msnher]

JD's mom - I am SO sorry for the loss of your son! You've come to the right place where there are no rules and you are free to talk as much or as little - and about anything - that you want. I would love to hear more about JD. I love his picture! My 28 yr old daughter, Stephanie, was killed in an ATV accident on 8-9-09. She left behind three young children whom my husband and I are raising. You will feel the sun again, but it takes a long time before you'll enjoy it. Hang on to us and we will hold your hand through this horrible nightmare.

The children arguing over my ashes didn't make me sad at all. I thought it was quite endearing! Personally, I don't care what they do with me after I'm gone. Death no longer frightens me. Let me rephrase that....MY death no longer frightens me. Losing my husband, another child or one of my grandchildren terrifies me.

I have to reign in that fear constantly or it paralyzes me. Sometimes I succeed more than others.

[ericasmom]

JD's Mom, so so sorry that you find yourself here, this other place that is home to so many now. I have been here for a long while, this being our 9th Christmas without Erica who was 19 when she was killed. Her car was hit by an Amtrak at a broken crossing in Kalamazoo, Michigan in July of 2003. She lived for 6 days though never awake...her brain stem all but severed. Eri was one funky little girl, I miss her each day. Your Boy is so handsome, I LOVE that black and white photo of him in the very beautiful video you made. We know how your heart is aching, we really know. No matter how or when we lost our Child, we are somehow all in the same kind of ache.

Thanks for the comments on the poem, it does indeed speak to the process for me.

Trudi, the sewing project sounds beautiful and time consuming. Is school just about out for break then? Are you going to return as a volunteer for the school? I sure hope that your Hubby gets well, fully recovers. What frustration he must feel with this.

Peace one day

[JD's Mom, Becky]

Modified.

[dwsmithrn]

hi my indigo friends....i am sorry i have not been able to be here with you in some time....my sadness has turned into depression and i am hoping that after january, i might be able to face the days a little better. these holidays are NOT holidays in my opinion....because my children and grandchildren and mother are coming on the 26th....i DID put some lights on the palm trees we used at nathan's services and a few angel ornaments on the larger of the two palms. it is ok....hanging the stockings almost put me down for good. i couldn't NOT hang nathan's; i HAD to hang it, but the fact that he isn't here and i held it in my hands and close to my heart and cried and cried for almost a good hour was just was crushing. i don't like these horrendous holidays....they should be called hellidays. i just want it all to be over, and soon. i am trying to do my part, put on the face that makes everybody else feel like i am ok, and make them feel like it ok to be around me....don;t want them to feel uncomfortable, afterall. these last 3 months have been horrible, i know. i have been such a downer i just thought it best not to be here at all...at least for everyone else's sake. i see some new names/faces here and i am so, so sorry for your loss....it is so terribly hard to even begin to think you have to be here. the hlidays are hard....i missed so much while i have been away, i am so sorry. i may not be back again until after january and i have mived through nathan's birthday and angel date. then, we'll see where i am. i am seeing the counselor more often and she is in contact with my MD....i know i am having trouble with all of this, but with everyone here in the same place, i think you all know what it is like, to be here. it is a terrible, horrible place to be. this is no kind of journey any one wants to take.

i am sorry we find ourselves here, and as we have all said at one time or another, really, this could happen to me, to us, to our family, seriously????? i don't think so...

this is a very sad week for me....no presents under the tree for nate, did not wrap a single one for him...he won't be here, not just this year, but any year, ever again....i can't live with this. i am not ready to accept this. is there something wrong with me? i think there is.....

i am signing off now....just know that i still think of you all, even if i could not sign on or even read.....i am tired and weary and sad .....but i always think of you....love, diane

[lolynbo]

SO A FRIEND OF OURS CAME OVER AND HES GOOD FRIENDS WITH BRENT...HESAID THE OTHER DAY BRENT WANTED TO TALK ABOUT KOURTNEY AND JUST TALKED AND TALKED ABOUT HER.....GIVES ME SUCHA WARM FEELING..THAT HE CARES AND HE LOVED MY GIRL..AND HE REMEMBERS..AND HE HURTS...AND HE STILLLLL CARES

[lolynbo]

AND IM STILL UNABLE TO TYPE IN ORANGE...COME PN PPL FIX IT

[Guest msnher]

Diane - Thank you for checking in and letting us know you are still around. Take all the time you need. My prayers go with you.

Lorri - My heart breaks for all of you. It's just so sad.

[ericasmom]

Diane, I am relieved that you were here today, but saddened by your aching heart. I wish that I could help lift you some, but it will happen after a time. The first year, the firsts of all things are so damn hard but facing the not firsts is damning too.All I know is that finding ways to live a good life again is daunting and different for everyone. I think that you are seeing your counselor more often and that she is working with a doctor shows that you are taking the steps to finding this. Body and brain chemistry is one area that is different for us all, finding the balance that has been swept away from our lives when so much has changed is quite a challenge. Keep sharing when you want, do not ever worry about sounding down with us, of course you are down, that is why we come here, to reach out to those who know and for many of us old-timers here, it is our way of lending a bit of hope.

Peace Diane

Lori, what a nice thing to know, that Brent is thinking of Kourtney.

JD's mom, nice poem indeed. I was not able to download the music you sent, don't know why.

[JD's Mom, Becky]

Modified.

[JD's Mom, Becky]

Modified.

[shorty16]

JD's Mom

WOW, I love that poem. You are blessed with writting grace like some others on here.

I posted on you original thread. We have similar stories. My 16 year old son died in a completely-preventable car crash about 1/4 mile from our home.

I know how you feel.

Colleen, Brian's Mother Forever

[JD's Mom, Becky]

Modified.

[ericasmom]

I will check it out JD's Mom. Thanks. Those that don't understand your poetry just, as you said, don't know the anguish of your situation. I hope that they never do but the anger that comes is normal. We all feel anger in our grief, at a disease, at a driver, at a township for their failure to keep safe their members...whomever or whatever was in part the reason our Children are not here right now. Anger is part of it.

[Guest msnher]

Becky - I love your poem. I understand your anger, your anguish. When my daughter died I didn't have the wherewithall to ask the right questions. She has friends who are convinced she was murdered. However, the investigation determined there was no foul play and I didn't have any fight left in me. Any energy we had was spent fighting for her children. We were in the end of the civil trial and beginning of the criminal trial against the woman who hurt them at the time of Stephanie's death. Sometimes I can't help but go to the "what ifs" or "if onlys".

[dwsmithrn]

becky...i love your poem and i understand it so well....i lost nathan to his own hand, it hurts so much...i will never understand 'why'....he was seemingly happy and invested in life, his career...he had his doctorate in OT and loved it....he specialized in geriatrics and absolutely loved his patients and they him. when he turned 32 on the 21st of january, i talked to him and he was fine, so it seemed, then i got a call from my other son 2 days later....he was gone. it was a terribly unexpected heart-breaking loss. i understand anger with loss. i understand your poem and i am impressed that you can express it so beautifully and share it with us. thank you for that. almost 11 months later, i still have bouts of anger. anger with myself that i did not see that my beautiful son was depressed (he hid it so well) that i, his mother, did not help him, i did not save him. the guilt just eats away at me, day after day. i should have noticed something in him. i failed my son. what kind of mother does that? i have anger, oh yes.

i am so sorry for your loss of you precious son. here we are, facing a holiday, the first, without our precious child. it is so hard, too hard to have to face. the last time i saw my nathan, was last christmas day. my husband and i are taking a weekend trip, away from here, just so i won't have to be here for a couple of days. then we are going over to my daughter's house for a gathering of sorts with the family on the 26th...changing things up may help a little....but i will still always, always, have nathan on my mind. and that will never go away.

again, becky, i am so sorry for your loss. your beautiful angel JD is looking down on you and smiling. i say that to myself a million times a day, but it still does not take away the pain of my aching heart. take care....love, diane

[dwsmithrn]

dee...thank you....it actually feels good to be back on here....maybe if i come back off and on, it will help. i did miss you all. even though i hate to see the new faces/names here. it saddens me deeply to know we have new angels. i am grateful to know that you all are still here and i can still come back and just 'be'. means alot. especially where we all 'are'....thanks.....diane

[dwsmithrn]

susannah....thanks for letting me know you care.....means a great deal in this situation. i missed you all so very much. it is just hard sometimes when you feel so down and out and you feel like you haven't a friend in this world, when i should know....i have a bunch of great friends...right here, just a click away. thanks for caring....love, diane

[Jeff's Mom]

From what I have read it seems as if the rules of driving in the states is much different then up here. We have very strict rules. No exceptions. Pulled over for drunk driving? An enforced breathalizer test. If it is positive? The car is automaticaly impounded and a large fine imposed immediately. Plus the driving license is temporarily revoked and you are hauled off in a police car to the station to pay the fine and sleep it off in the drunk tank. The second time around? Prison! No way out. Major investigation if a fatality occurs. Car impounded and auctioned off by police. Absolutely no use of cell phones while driving. Another HUGE fine and believe me they do enforce it. And seat belt wearing is a must. Another huge fine if found driving with out the seatbelt.

Kids at school taking drivers ed are required to watch simulated crash scenes and possible effects of what can happen if they drive while using a cell or are drunk. They are graphic and extremely gory in detail. It is done on purpose to scare the crap out of them. So far, it appears to be bringing the incidents down. So, I guess it is working.

We also have a no gun law and we do not have the death penalty. However, we are finding our prisons are filling up to maximum capacity due to other crimes.

Becky...I'm just wondering if this woman was using her cell and looked down when she hit your son.

[dwsmithrn]

kate, i love your strict laws....NC is working on enforcing more strick laws and has passed many new ones, especially for young drivers. South carolina (where 2 of my sons live) where nathan lived....have passed newer, more strick laws....and it seems to be working. more states need to work harder for such laws. my husband and i really want more laws passed on the gun issue, especially NOW....what heartache we have had to endure this year.

[ericasmom]

I am all for no cells while driving, it is a huge distraction even if it hands free as your mind is at least partly on the conversation, not the road.

Diane, of course you are always able to come in and out as you see fit.

As far as anger is concerned, some of the anger we feel after we get through a few months of grief is directed at those folks responsible for the death, whether it be a driver, a doctor, a cancer, a train in our case. The anger changes though over time, as it is never just one persons actions that take another. My Girl was following the law, no left turn when light is flashing, but the light was not flashing so she went, but was her music too loud? Was she on the phone, I don't know, all I know is the train hit her car when she was almost over the tracks, and I pray and hope that she never saw it, never felt that panic.

We are angry but we are afraid of being too angry at our Child, what will that mean after all? Eventually we work through the anger and make our way to understanding as best we can. Nobody went out that night to harm my Girl. The driver of the train was simply following his schedule and he was never told to slow down through that crossing even though the company knew that it was broken, even though the township knew it was broken. My anger had to be dispersed in order to move forward.

[shorty16]

JD's Mom

Yes, I do understand and decision my son made that day ended his life. I will forever be sad he is not in our lives. But I do understand that I must live - if not for our 2 surviving children (now 21, 18). I get much comfort from this site.

Dee - What a BEAUtiful day today. The sun is shining and wind is not too bad!?!?!

OMG - The Packers are lossing. What is happening to the world!!!

Colleen, Brian's Mother Forever

[JD's Mom, Becky]

Modified.

[ericasmom]

JD's Mom, I know that at this early phase in your grief you feel that the driver is living her life and has a child and can have more, but really, what you must also realize is that most folks that accidentally kill another feel horrible and do not have a day in their lives where they do not think about what happened in that tiny frame of time. It forever changes them too, not perhaps to the extent that we are changed, but in ways we cannot fully understand either, not being in their shoes. I had an English teacher in high school, she was shy kind of woman, young, pretty and one day she accidentally hit a child on a bike, the child died. She came back to school but the rumors and the whispering was awful, she was jittery, not herself at all, and eventually she quit, she could not go on as she had. She was not drinking and this was way before cell phones, (I am 55) and she simply could not stop in time. End of a life, and end of a young life and complete altering another life. We want to blame, we need to at first, but there is also this strange place where accidents happen and they are a moment in time that holds so much loss and sadness, but often they do not hold blame. One of the hardest things to reconcile is the lack of control we really do have in this world. All we really own is how we are going to behave and how we are going to carry on.

[dwsmithrn]

dee....i DO know what you are talking about and what you mean by the 'blame game'....i have been there and some days my mind goes back there....on the back burner, i still blame a certain person for the end result...i know i have told the story before....so i won't go into it again, not now. i am learning, or trying to learn to forgive those around nathan that could have, should have helped when he needed the help and had, in a way, cried out for help. there was no excuse for those closest to him not to help him, or try harder to help. i do hold some blame there. i am over 250 miles away from him, i couldn't see his down side...they could....they did, on occasion. i am working with driving the blame out of my head and heart....it is a very difficult thing to do, when as you say, those people are living their lives, with their families in tact, while we are living a hell on earth, without our children. how fair is it? what sense can come out of this? even though i don't blame them 100%, because i place so much blame on myself, i still disperse blame to others. i do, however, put soooo, soooo much blame on a certain person who will remain nameless, because i do believe this person is nameless. god have mercy on this person.

blame, shame, guilt, grief, are all under the same umbrella of this terrible "journey"....i hate it....i hate this life....it all sucks...

i hate that my little nathan was so miserable, so unhappy, so depressed that he thought this was the only way out. i hate so much that i didn't see this coming. i am a nurse, my husband a dr. and WE didn't see it coming....what does that say about us as parents? we feel so guilty much of the time. we talk often, and i am so glad we are able to do that....it helps us feel together on this....we have grown closer rather than apart and thank goodness for that. but it doesn't take the pain away for either one of us.

yes, losing a child is the most horrendous pain....do we live through it? i don't know. time will tell.

[summergirl]

Becky - I am so sorry for the loss of your son Jared....I welcome you to this place I call home - my home away from home where I can say and be who I am - Yet I am so sorry for the reason we are all here. I watched the video, amazing.

Diane - Guilt - what an awful thing we carry around......as I read your words "I am a nurse, my husband a Dr. and we didn't see it coming"!! brought back memories of that first year without Jessica....We never saw it coming, we never imagined IT would happen to us....The night Jessica left us we were in bed and my husbands fire/ambulance radio went off and it said "Adult woman unconsicous at Fiddlers' Cove" - I rolled over and snuggled in my blankets and a few minutes later the radio called for "Adult woman unresponsive at Fiddler's Cove" - and again I rolled over, snuggled in and went back to sleep for about 2 hours and then the knock on the door.... I was consumed with guilt for a long time knowing I lay there and heard those calls and NEVER once considered it was my Jessica.....How could a Mother not know ?? I have let go of my guilt but I am almost 6 years on this horrible, long journey and with time you begin a new, different life. I am happy that you and your hubby are closer and can share your grief and hold each other. Bless you

Went to a Christmas party last night at a friends house, had a nice time but was so glad to get home in my comfies,,,,Today was our first really cold day, about 31 degrees. No signs of snow in the forcast and that is ok with me however I would not mind a good snow storm and getting snowed in for a few days.....I like to hibernate in the winter....lol

Tavian is laying on the couch watching a movie, all snuggled in with his blanket...I believe he is tired (although he will NEVER admit it) and it is good for him to just be and do nothing...

I talked to my mom this morning and we both cried,,,,seems like we always cry when we talk as we talk alot about my brother Billy and Jessica. It is sad to know that we were brought closer by the deaths of our child.....but we truely understand this journey and can talk as I cannot to my siblings......She is doing ok but wants to go home to the farm yet knowing that will not happen, her and my dad are never going to be in a place where they can live on their own again....I am going to see them this Spring when all is in bloom -

I will post a pic from the Christmas party - it is me (on left) and my friend Linda. (Sure wish my Jessica was in this pic with me..sigh)

Love, Peace and Strength to all, Kathy

[ericasmom]

Kathy, I know what you mean about going to holiday parties, I love going but I really love coming home. We had our school party on Friday eve, it was not a late night, ending at around 8:00, but it was loud and I am so tired on a Friday that one glass of wine was almost too much. Friday was a very hard day and I am concerned with the two kids who caused so much unrest in my classroom. Two boys, eight year old boys, were suspended on Friday for sexual harassment of another child in my classroom. EIGHT YEARS OLD and the explicit remark one boy told a girl in my room at the lunch table one day was enough to curl your hair. ONe boy is the other boy's patsy if you will, he does what this other boy tells hm to do, unfortunately. The other boy is always in trouble but this takes the cake. I was sad that they would say these kinds of things and sad that two girls in my room heard them, they were directed to one of them, and the innocence lost from the girls is just so sad. So I was not in the best mode for a party on Friday night. The two will not be back until Tuesday and if I had it my way, they would extend it another day to really help the parents see that this is SERIOUS, that nobody is making this up, that the Child needs help. Oh well, I sure did rant. Anyhow, Kathy, the party sounds nice, you look great!

Diane, I think that the first few years is that time that we find the demons and try to erradicate them from our lives. They pop in now and then but for the most part, I am done with guilt and anger. It took a lot of work, and you are doing that kind of work, and for some, the anger does not go away, as was the case in my former husband's life. He just would never allow himself to let go of his anger because it was so tied in with the guilt, if he was not as angry, he felt that it meant he was not honoring Erica. For him, it was his way to live out his days. I do not mean to prescribe what anyone should be doing or feeling...just saying how I have gotten through things. Think of snowflakes, no two alike, just like us, not two grieving parents alike, but boy, we have a lot in common.

I hope that you understand that you had no way of knowing that Nathan was feeling so low because he hid that so well from you. Just like so many other parents on this site whose Child took his life, they do hide their deepest sorrows and most will say that they never saw it coming. So glad taht you and Husband are getting away a bit, I pray that your time away is good and that it fuels you for the grandkids on the 26th. Peace.

[summergirl]

Dee - I am so sorry about the incident in your classroom.....it is so hard to believe that 8 year old boys could even know those things and I hate to say it but it has to come from the home environment....this is not something that is a joke, it is serious as you said and this child needs help, why is it that the parents do not see that ??? It is scary to think of where this child will be a few years from now if steps are not taken to get him the help he needs now..... I too wish there was more that could be done, so many children being brought up in ways that I cannot even imagine..... I worry about who Tavian is friends with so I always make it a point to meet the parents, exchange phone numbers etc....I will say a prayer for this little boy and the other child who is being caught up in his web.... Thank you for the compliment - I always laugh at pics of myself and say "wow, I could use a facelift to get rid of those wrinkles" but then again I have earned each and everyone of them - Kathy

[Jeff's Mom]

dee....i DO know what you are talking about and what you mean by the 'blame game'....i have been there and some days my mind goes back there....on the back burner, i still blame a certain person for the end result...i know i have told the story before....so i won't go into it again, not now. i am learning, or trying to learn to forgive those around nathan that could have, should have helped when he needed the help and had, in a way, cried out for help. there was no excuse for those closest to him not to help him, or try harder to help. i do hold some blame there. i am over 250 miles away from him, i couldn't see his down side...they could....they did, on occasion. i am working with driving the blame out of my head and heart....it is a very difficult thing to do, when as you say, those people are living their lives, with their families in tact, while we are living a hell on earth, without our children. how fair is it? what sense can come out of this? even though i don't blame them 100%, because i place so much blame on myself, i still disperse blame to others. i do, however, put soooo, soooo much blame on a certain person who will remain nameless, because i do believe this person is nameless. god have mercy on this person.

blame, shame, guilt, grief, are all under the same umbrella of this terrible "journey"....i hate it....i hate this life....it all sucks...

i hate that my little nathan was so miserable, so unhappy, so depressed that he thought this was the only way out. i hate so much that i didn't see this coming. i am a nurse, my husband a dr. and WE didn't see it coming....what does that say about us as parents? we feel so guilty much of the time. we talk often, and i am so glad we are able to do that....it helps us feel together on this....we have grown closer rather than apart and thank goodness for that. but it doesn't take the pain away for either one of us.

yes, losing a child is the most horrendous pain....do we live through it? i don't know. time will tell.

Diane...you must not beat yourself up over this. You and your husband are not responsible for what happened. Depression can mask itself in a cunning disguise. I should know. Jeff did the same thing. I have often thought to myself what I could have said or done to have made a difference. I am not a mind reader. I loved him unconditionally. He refused to open up completely and let me in. How can you help someone that does not let you know how they are truly feeling? You can't. I have decided to let my son rest in peace and let go of all negative feeling. He is now at peace and I need to allow him that rest. He will not find peace if I continue to feel toxic. I choose to honour his memory by making a positive change and speaking out openly about depression and suicide. We need to break down the barriers of stigmatization. Perhaps we can help to make a difference in a positive way. We can not place all responsibility on others for our well being as easy and sometimes justified as it may seem. We are responsible for our own actions in the end. People can and often do let us down. When that happens...I choose to move on.

Our sadness at their absence in our lives will continue. We will never forget them. How could we? They were ours for a short time, but returned to their real home. Nathan knew that you and your husband loved him. He found himself in a bad way and was not able to express his need for help. We can often miss the signs. Your love for him is obvious. Please find peace within yourself. I am glad that your husband is such a strong support. My husband is as well. That in itself is something to be grateful for. Many do not have even that. Take care.

[Jeff's Mom]

Kathy, I know what you mean about going to holiday parties, I love going but I really love coming home. We had our school party on Friday eve, it was not a late night, ending at around 8:00, but it was loud and I am so tired on a Friday that one glass of wine was almost too much. Friday was a very hard day and I am concerned with the two kids who caused so much unrest in my classroom. Two boys, eight year old boys, were suspended on Friday for sexual harassment of another child in my classroom. EIGHT YEARS OLD and the explicit remark one boy told a girl in my room at the lunch table one day was enough to curl your hair. ONe boy is the other boy's patsy if you will, he does what this other boy tells hm to do, unfortunately. The other boy is always in trouble but this takes the cake. I was sad that they would say these kinds of things and sad that two girls in my room heard them, they were directed to one of them, and the innocence lost from the girls is just so sad. So I was not in the best mode for a party on Friday night. The two will not be back until Tuesday and if I had it my way, they would extend it another day to really help the parents see that this is SERIOUS, that nobody is making this up, that the Child needs help. Oh well, I sure did rant. Anyhow, Kathy, the party sounds nice, you look great!

Diane, I think that the first few years is that time that we find the demons and try to erradicate them from our lives. They pop in now and then but for the most part, I am done with guilt and anger. It took a lot of work, and you are doing that kind of work, and for some, the anger does not go away, as was the case in my former husband's life. He just would never allow himself to let go of his anger because it was so tied in with the guilt, if he was not as angry, he felt that it meant he was not honoring Erica. For him, it was his way to live out his days. I do not mean to prescribe what anyone should be doing or feeling...just saying how I have gotten through things. Think of snowflakes, no two alike, just like us, not two grieving parents alike, but boy, we have a lot in common.

I hope that you understand that you had no way of knowing that Nathan was feeling so low because he hid that so well from you. Just like so many other parents on this site whose Child took his life, they do hide their deepest sorrows and most will say that they never saw it coming. So glad taht you and Husband are getting away a bit, I pray that your time away is good and that it fuels you for the grandkids on the 26th. Peace.

Dee...sorry about the problems with the boys in your classroom. I can only imagine the frustration on your part! When Jeff was in six he came to the aid of another boy that was the constant victim of bullying. Jeff being tall for his age looked older then he was. He took the boy that was the problem and put him on the fence with the back of his jacket slipped down the spike of the fence. He did not hurt him but placed him gently with his jacket sliding through the spikes. He told him to apologize to the kid or stay there reflecting on his actions.The boy had pushed, and pushed and pushed. Jeff was defending a young boy that was a recent immigrant that had a physical disability. He told the kid to lay off and leave the boy alone. Jeff wound up being sent home and almost expelled for helping him. And another time a girl that was somewhat challenged was chained to the flag pole in junior high by a bunch of punks. He again went to her aid. Again he was called out on the carpet. As a parent I would say to him...respect others, never violence, but go for it if you truly need to help someone. The teachers were not or could not take action due to who the parents were. I always believed in standing up for the guy being slammed. And the last example I have is of one of the teachers being wrongfully accused of abuse to the other kids. This teacher was found guilty of enforcing actual detention on the kids when they were out of line. Perish the thought! Poor teacher. Little brats actually took over the classroom and tried to bully the teacher into what they would do or not do based on their families. Again, Jeff went to his defence. The families had him dismissed as he was too strict. Hang in there Dee. Don't let anyone bully you.

[ericasmom]

Right on Kathy, about the earning of wrinkles, each one put there for experience. I think that being in our 50's is way different than when our own Moms were in their 50's, and while the ads and magazine covers show younger and younger stars, there stands women like Diane Keaton, Meryl Streep, and others who age right alongside of us. There is much to be said about the knowledge that comes with these years, and I so love it. Yes, the body is way less elastic and new clothes are needed in order to dress this body that seems to be a different size than my old body, but what the heck, we are getting older and as long as we can keep our bodies working and our brains active, we are lucky for our wrinkles.

[heartbeataway]

Hi guys,

I've been so lax in visiting lately. And when I do I lurk ....

I find the holidays so tough and as others have said, coming here is like coming home to family who understand and care.

We have no plans for Christmas Day ..... we have not put a tree up but have decorated outside and I put the garland up on the staircase and banisters.

We also have a two and four year old foster boys who will be with us for Christmas .... so, we will be playing Santa. Who would have thought that? :-)

And, we had an adoption interview Wednesday night. We are hoping for a little girl and we are anxiously waiting to hear the decision of who was chosen by the adoption committee to be her forever family.

So, we wait ...... this could be the best Christmas we've had in a very long time.

Just sharing or updating or whatever ......

I don't feel right saying Merry Christmas or Happy Holidays because I know it's not a jolly, festive time of year for the majority of us. So, I'll just send love and pray that the sweet memories from past holidays will give strength and add a sweet, warm spirit to whatever you're doing.

[mikesmomrs]

Well, thought I would just give a check before I turn off the computer, and two wonderful surprises! Mr. Sunshine, his smile coming back out at me, all blue eyes and golden hair, and his mom telling us that they have two wonderful little boys to share Christmas with, as well as that they are in the final stages of a possible adoption! Thank you so much for sharing, Bonnie, and checking in. I send my wishes to you and Rich and your little guests for the best Christmas that you could possibly have in this new realm that we live in...your sweet JASON will be right there with you, his spirit surrounding you with love.

And then, another terrific and welcome surprise...Diane! So glad you have checked in. I had sent you an email a while back, but didn't hear back and figured that you just needed some space and some time. I am so glad to see you here and to see your sweet Nathan's smile, beaming off the page. I am of course, so very sorry that you are having such a difficult time, especially over these holidays and then into January. I am however, so very glad that Jim is right there with you, helping you, holding you, understanding and just being. You are in my prayers for strength and healing. As Dee said, this is so early, and these holidays are so tough, it just is so difficult to see ourselves getting through them.

Kate: Your Jeff was a person of great integrity; I am so glad that you have those memories of his strength and honor.

JD's mom: I am so very sorry for the loss of your dear son Jared, but so glad that you came to BI to share your precious son and the memories that you hold so dear. I read your poem and every word reverberated in my brain. You have come to a good place, a place of comfort, understanding and support. I look forward to sharing more of your son and the sweet memories that you hold close to you.

Susannah: Thank you so much for telling us again the story of the birds and owls and Stephanie. I get goose bumps reading about it. I had forgotten the part where Stephanie had told you in casual conversation before her death that she would communicate with you with birds, if anything happened to her.

Dee: So very sorry for the incident at school. I do agree that the parents need to get a message about this and that another day of suspension would perhaps have delivered a stronger message to all of the parents. It is pretty shocking what the kids are coming out with now...I believe it is partly due to the things they are so wrongly exposed to. Some go home after school, to an empty house and an unlimited number of cable tv channels that they can watch just about anything they want to at any time. We found a LOT of that going on when Davis was in grade school. He would come home and tell us that so-and-so told him that they had watched this movie, and we knew that the movie they spoke of was rated R and carried a very negative message to it viewers, as well as pretty explicit scenes. I hope that you are able to have a very good and relaxing school vacation over the holidays and you can be at one with your spirit for a bit.

Kathy: Yes, we have earned our wrinkles, and by the way, you look beautiful, and I love your hair! I am glad that you are planning on visiting your parents in the spring...I think you mentioned previously that you will take Tavian with you. Your Jess will be with you, as well.

We've had an up and down week and I am trying hard to focus on the "up." Mike was in the hospital again, but not an infection this time. It seems that they kind of forgot to adjust Mike's blood pressure meds when, after losing 150 lbs, he didn't need it anymore, so we wound up at the ER when his blood pressure reading at his check up at his PCP's office was 78/50 or so. Doc wanted to send him to the ER in an ambulance and of course, Mike said no. THAT won't happen again. If we had gone in an ambulance, we wouldn't have had to be so aggressive when the girl at the intake desk "couldn't find" the doctor's call-ahead that Mike was coming in for emergency treatment. After her third look-see at the "log," and my continued insistance that he needed to be seen right away, someone else went into the ER and found that the doctor in there had actually taken the message himself and then put the post-it note in his pocket without telling anyone. So, of course we were brought right in, and they did admit him, and that is how they found out it was the high blood pressure meds being taken by someone who no longer needed them. At one point while in the ER his orthostatic (standing) blood pressure went to 55/44. Over the next 48 hours, they managed to stabilize it with withdrawal from the meds and administering of fluids by IV. (this was all at our local hospital). and he came home on Friday night. They (the hospital where they are supposed to do his surgery) are supposed to do another presentation to the tumor board on Tues to determine the new course for his cancer treatment. Can't remember if I told you all that they now do not want to do the initial intensive chemo treatment, as they now think his health is too fragile to withstand it (after they received the reports from his earlier hospitalization for the pancreatitis and double pneumonia). On Wednesday of last week, the oncologist at Dartmouth called to discuss it, and said "If I gave him induction chemotherapy (4,000 units) now, I would be killing him." So, they are planning to move ahead to the radiation treatment therapy with the minimum chemo dose (50 units), for five weeks, five times a week. They would then reassess to see how much had been shrunk and plan the surgery on those results. We continue to pray and to hope and to hold onto our faith.

Yesterday, Kameron came over and helped me put up the lights outside and then we (Kam and I) went looking for a Christmas tree. Mike wanted me to get a fake one, but I wanted a real one, so of course every fake one I saw just didn't please me. Mike called me while I was out and said with the uncertainty of our plans doctor/hospital wise, that he really wanted me to get a fake one because if he got called into the hospital unexpectedly for any reason, that would mean leaving a live tree in the house, without anyone here to care for it. So, I gave in and got the fake one. Kam and I were at K-Mart looking for one, and while standing there at the return desk (I was returning something), the background music caught my attention and they were playing, of all songs, "Amazing Grace." IN K-MART!!! As most of you know, the "Christian" part of the public displays and celebrations of Christmas have mostly been relegated to greetings such as "Happy Holidays," etc, with no traditional Carols being sung, and much of the music you hear in public us of the "Santa" or "winter" type. I stood there, shocked and then was able to tell the clerk how much I appreciated hearing it and that it was the very first time I had ever heard Amazing Grace played in a public environment other than church. We chatted about that for a moment, and then I mentioned to her that recently on a vacation, we had visited my BIL who has a small recording studio and that my hubby and I both had recorded that song while there. She looked at me and said "Well, you do realize now, that this a sign. I don't know what sign, but a sign, for you." (she had no idea of Mike's health problems, nor anything about young Mike's having died.) I said "Oh, yes, I am well acquainted with signs." She looked at me with a questioning look and I told her about how we frequently see signs from our son, who had died. She very kindly expressed her sorrow and empathy, and I then mentioned that my husband had cancer, and she then said that she would certainly keep him in her prayers, and then spoke of her own gratitude for having been there while I got another sign. All of this, at a return desk at K-MART! A place where I shop maybe twice a year, if that.

And speaking of gratitude, coming here, in the wee hours of the morning (or any time for that matter) and being able to "talk" to you all is such a blessing for me that I am so very thankful for.

Today, Damon came so we could celebrate his birthday (6 days late), and to spend some play time with his Papa and also with his brother, Kameron. (Chandler couldn't be here.) Kam and Damon had such a good time together. Damon LOVES being with both of his brothers, but does seem to have a closer relationship with Kameron. After they both played outside for a bit, they came in and played with Legos with their Papa. Cathi and Jamie also came over, later. Sarah came to pick up Damon, and then Cathi took Kameron home, while Jamie stayed behind to help with the decorating of the tree. He would put the ornaments on as I took them out of the boxes, and we chatted and remembered previous Christmases as we worked. I really enjoyed having him there and told him so. When Cathi came back, she helped me put up Mike's tree (a small one we've had that we all put messages on and then on Christmas eve, the messages are put into his stocking to be read out loud the next day), and since the boys didn't get time to decorate the wreath for Mike's memorial site, she did it and got it ready for us to place there tomorrow. It was a nice family day, in which we were all able to put the sad reminders that we feel during this season "on the shelf" for the day, and also set aside the upcoming challenges we face with Mike's health, in order to create some new "re-memories" for these young boys to carry with them as they grow.

I send my love to all of you, as our hearts are united even more so during this Christmas season, as we all try to move through our sorrow over not having our precious child here with us.

Speaking of hearts, while Kameron and I were out yesterday, we saw three different distinct hearts, in the oddest of places, to include this blue one that we saw on the pavement as we came out of Wendy's, and the one in the sour cream as we ate pizza when we took Damon and Kam to lunch today. Later, as I was putting away some laundry, I saw another (that I hadn't seen before) on a pajama top as I was putting it away.

[JD's Mom, Becky]

Modified.

[Susie_q512]

In reading the discussion and posts regarding blame, I wish I had someone to blame. Someone or something that I could direct blame and the anger I feel towards. The truth regarding the car accident that killed Shannon is simply that she was at fault. For some reason, she had a moment of distraction, lost control of her car, and went into the path of an oncoming SUV. Neither driver had time to react. No skid marks. No evidence that either made any attempt whatsoever to avoid impact. The investigation revealed that she was not using her phone. Her radio didn't work, so that wasn't a factor. Speed wasn't involved. She was wearing her seat belt. We had said our "goodbyes" and each left the home for work. Approximately 3 minutes later, about a mile from our home, she was killed. I have come to suspect that she may have been looking for or reaching for something in the passenger seat. Maybe she thought she had left something she needed at home and was looking to see if she had everything needed with her? Maybe an animal crossed the road in front of her? Maybe another vehicle passing her crossed the center line and she swerved to avoid it? All we know is that she left the right side of the road on an even section of the grass on a beautiful day and over corrected. She went into the other lane at a curved angle, not a sharp or severe turn. The road was straight with nothing to impair visibility. Her small '93 Toyota Corolla was hit on the passenger side at the absolute weakest point in the car's structure. She took her last strangled breath literally within moments of impact. There was much trauma to her tiny body. She was only 5' 1" and weighed 97 pounds. Massive trauma to the back of her head. Generalized chest trauma. Right arm broken in several places. Neck broken. Possibly back broken. She bled out. Still waiting for the Coroner's final report, but these are the injuries I am aware of. She was never conscious....for that I am thankful. I choose to believe that it happened so quickly that she did not have the time to feel fear or surprise. I choose to believe that she was here in this life, and then there in the afterlife immediately. I choose to believe that her soul was snatched by her Guardian Angel at the very moment of impact. Here and then there. I choose to believe that she never felt lost or confused. That she was immediately surrounded by the love of God and Heavenly beauty and peace.

I blame myself to some degree as I had a bad feeling, intuition that when I was saying goodbye to her that it would be the last time I saw my daughter alive. I replay those moments in time, wishing I could re-do it and simply drive her to her babysitting job myself. Although I have not become so angry at God that I have renounced Him, I am angry because I do not understand "why" He allowed this to happen. Of my two daughters, Shannon was the baby. She had just turned 16 in June....she was dead 3 months later. She was a good driver.....much better than her older sister. I had absolute confidence in her driving ability. She had driven almost every day since getting her Learner's Permit. She drove in all kinds of conditions. She wasn't one to panic. The day was beautiful....weather was absolutely perfect. I suppose that all the ingredients for disaster came together perfectly at that one small moment in time.

I arrived at the accident scene. I saw her car. I saw her lifeless body in the ambulance. She was in a body bag. They had covered her so that I would not see the horror of her injuries. Only a small oval shaped section of her beautiful face was exposed for me to see. Anytime that I tried to remove the sheets, the Sheriff would compassionately put his hand on mine and tell me that he didn't want those images burned into my memory. I tried to go to her car to get her belongings, and again he very compassionately stopped me. At one point he told me that I had seen more than any mother should ever have to see, and he thought it better that I not go there to that place of torment. He may have been right as the images of the scene and my daughter in a body bag are forever burned into my memory. Even the items under the driver's seat are saturated with her blood. The police, EMTs, my brother who is a volunteer fireman, and a family friend who is a war veteran have all stated that I should never see the inside of her car. According to each of them, it is the worst they have ever seen. If there is anything that I can be thankful for in this tragedy, it's that Shannon was spared the trauma of the accident. She probably never felt pain or anything else. Two people stopped to help. They were with Shannon as she took her last couple rattling/choking breaths. They stayed with her and prayed over her and for her family. I am also thankful for that. Those are the only things I am thankful for. I should be thankful that she is safe, and I no longer have to worry about her.....but I'm not. I want her "safe" here with me. I want her back. I want the re-do. I want to wake up in a hospital bed to find I have been in a coma and this has all been a terrible dream.

[JD's Mom, Becky]

Modified.

[ericasmom]

JD's MOM< how could I ever think you heartless, I sure hope my post did not indicate that at all...just saying that in the early stages, the anger is evident, it may soften to something different, it might not, but for now, it is what is necessary. YOur poetry shows us where you are in this battle you are having with what or who took your Boy. I have written many poems and short stories since Eri died and the transformation from the early grief with anger and guilt to now is pretty evident, it changes as we change. My pointing out where this woman may be in her grief is just that, pointing it out. And she does have grief too, as her life changed that day but of course in different ways, but it will never be as it once was.

I hope my words caused no pain, never want to do that.

Bonnie, as I saw your Boy today, I celebrated. So good to see him and wonderful to know that two little ones are blessed over the holdiays living with the two of you. I will finger cross in hopes of your little girl.

[Guest msnher]

My heart breaks for each of you. Trying to put together the pieces of your child's last moment on this side of life. I am going to share the following with you in hopes of giving you a small bit of comfort.

After Stephanie died we found out she was seeing a man who was transitioning out of prison. He was in prison for felony stalking his girlfriend. He had hogtied her and left her in a field to die. We later found out that he had tried to slit his wife's throat. Stephanie was with him, riding his 4 wheeler when she died. Supposedly no one was around and she was riding by herself at the time of the accident. She was riding a newer machine that was too advanced for her capabilities. She was riding on a paved road. Those of you who know, know there is a huge difference when riding on dirt and on pavement. She was wearing a helmet. She was going the speed limit, but still much too fast for a four wheeler on pavement. She came to a curve in the road, lost control of the machine, and drove into the field - straight into the barbed wire fence. Her neck hit the wire, the machine kept going, ripping the fence apart. Stephanie's body was thrown across the barbed wire - her neck even with the wire. Her carotid artery was severed, cutting all oxygen from her brain. She was dead as soon as that happened, but her body was thrown another 15 feet, where she laid and bled out. There could have been a neurologist on site and he/she wouldn't have been able to save her. Now...for the miracle my family adhere's to.

The night before Stephanie died her sister, my older daughter - Amanda, dreamed Stephanie was on a four wheeler crashing into a barbed wire fence. In Amanda's dream there was a man on the back of the machine with his hands on Stephanie's shoulders. It appeared he was pushing Stephanie's neck into the barbed wire.

Amanda stayed with me the whole week after Stephanie died. Steph died on a Sunday morning. Amanda told me about the dream, in tears, on Tuesday. She kept having the same dream and was afraid to go to sleep. We found out about the man Stephanie was seeing and we were sure she had been murdered, as some of Stephanie's friends also believed. Steph's funeral was on Friday. That Friday night Amanda and I stayed up visiting with Jennifer - my youngest daughter - because she was leaving for home (Iowa) the next morning. Amanda drifted off into a fitful sleep on the love seat while Jennifer and I sat on the sofa visiting. Amanda was curled into a tight ball. I had some anointed oil so I put it on her forehead and Jennifer and I prayed over her. I had no sooner asked for angels to guide Amanda's dreams then she (Amanda) rolled over, stretching herself out, and sighing "Ohhh." The next morning Amanda shared what happened to her during those moments.

"Stephanie came to me. She told me 'I'm okay, Amanda! The reason I screamed before hitting the fence is I was scared. The man on the back of the four wheeler was Jesus taking my spirit before I ever hit the fence. I love you and will always be with you.' "

Regardless of whether one believes in Jesus or not, that was a miracle for my family. It didn't take away the pain of her death, but it did help.

[hoosiermom]

Hello Indigos

I read all of your stories with tears in my eyes and a heavy heart. Just can't respond to them right now but know that I think of all of you every day.

Trying to post a picture of Brianna's stone, and a picture of me with my two daughters (taken Saturday night) My youngest daughter Brandi is the one wearing glasses, oldest daughter is Justine. Love my girls more than anything in the world.

Love and peace to all, Jenn

[JD's Mom, Becky]

Modified.

[JD's Mom, Becky]

Modified.

[Guest msnher]

I love the bands of light, Becky! I am a firm believer that our children reach out to us in whatever way they can. I think, in the beginning, our pain is too great for us to recognize the signals. It would seem to me your Jared found a way to let you know he is in the light. I've only had a few dreams that I know were from Stephanie. In the beginning, although I appreciated the dreams, they brought little comfort in light of the fact she was still gone. Now, those dreams and other signs mean the world to me.

Carol, what a scare you had with Mike/Ralph! My goodness! It would seem God even has angels at KMart. What I really noticed in your story, however, is that you stated you, too, recorded your singing. Please share it with us???

Jenn - I love the pictures of your girls!

Bonnie, I am so happy for you and your new additions. Young ones bring the magic of Christmas back, don't they? Last year, I told Mariah there was no such thing as Santa....I had a good reason for telling her, but I can't remember the reason now. Her first response was, "Does Grandpa know?" Then she burst into laughter and said, "Grandma, you're so silly! There is too a Santa. We just saw Mrs Clause this morning." (while we were downtown shopping) I told her she must be right..

Dee, the incident in your classroom hits very close to home for me. Last year, if the principal didn't know our situation, Jasmine would have been suspended for sexual harrasment. I'm sure the parents of the boys she grabbed wonder what in the world is going on in her (Jasmine's) home life. Under her therapist's direction, we began treating Jasmine's inappropriate sexual behavior the same way we would any other infraction - timeout. She has not gotten into trouble once, so far, this year. I am hoping my lack of explaining what "neutered" meant - exactly - to Jonathon and making a very bad joke of it last week will have no lasting effects. Because of what they've been through and the fact that 10yr old Mariah's body is changing right before their eyes, we've discussed sexuality a little more than one would a different child. Mostly we talk about respect for oneself and for others. We want to remove all shame associated with their bodies because of the abuse they endured. Even though they are so young, my biggest fear is for them to turn to drugs and/or alcohol and sex when they are older - really not that many years away. I wish my motives for wanting them to stay clear of those harmful choices wasn't a selfish one, but having gone through it with their mother I know I don't have it in me to go through it with them, too. If they have a question, I answer it (except for the neutered thing - geeze, I'm such an idiot. I'll wait and see if he asks again and handle it differently). So, anyway...I feel sorry for everyone involved in the incident in your classroom.

I have so much to do and so little desire to do it with. It is snowing on the mountain and spitting at us in the valley. I just don't feel like getting out.

Kathy, Rhonda, Colleen, Diane, and anyone else I may have missed...I send you love.

I think I'll hide from my chores by taking a quick nap.

Susannah/Stephanie's mom

[Guest msnher]

Karen - how are you?

[JD's Mom, Becky]

Here's my current desktop pic for December, and how it appears with the lights. My angel.

I am very thankful for the many pictures that I do have of Jared, just wish I had more with me in them, but I was usually the picture taker.

[Guest msnher]

Becky - What a good looking boy!.

[Jeff's Mom]

Here's my current desktop pic for December, and how it appears with the lights. My angel.

I am very thankful for the many pictures that I do have of Jared, just wish I had more with me in them, but I was usually the picture taker.

Becky...thanks for sharing your pics of Jared. And another thing...make sure you are in some photos as well. If anything ever happened to you your family would definitely want to see them.

[JD's Mom, Becky]

Thank you Susannah! I remember when he was going through the terrible two's that old ladies would stop me in the grocery store and comment on how cute he was or how beautiful his eyes were, and I would always tell them "God made him that way to keep me from beating him". lol, as he used to really try my patience at that age! Once when he was about 2-3, I came in from the dogroom to find that he had sprayed an entire can of PAM onto my tiled kitchen floor! I came to an abrupt halt as I was afraid for my footing, and he looked up at me just as proud as punch and said "look mommy, I made your floor all shiny".

[Jeff's Mom]

I have just read the recent posts from last evening and today. I feel so badly for all of you. I can't read the details of the events without the tears streaming down my face. It is a horror that no parent should ever have to experience. Yet it happens, as we all know too well. I feel very deeply for the pain and loss that you are experiencing. We try to take some comfort in the knowledge that they are in a better place. The pain of separation sometimes is beyond overwhelming. You are still in the very early days and stages of grief. One day you will slowly begin to find the cloud lifting It may not seem like it now, but it will. Very slowly...but it will happen. Pray, eat well, try to get a reasonable amount of rest and stay strong.

Carol...how is Mike doing? Hope you are holding up ok. Thinking of you.

[briansdad]

Becky,

Your story about the day your son died took me back.

Brian had a collision with a tractor trailer while riding a motorcycle.The collision caused the left side of his chest to be crushed.It tore his carotid artery and jugular vein.When we went to ID his body the nurses had cleaned him up to where he just looked like he was sleeping.I couldn't bring myself to look under the sheet to see the extent of his injuries. I'm glad I didn't.It's too bad the nurses couldn't have cleaned up your son some.I'm sure that's not the last memory you would want to have of him.

God, it is so unnatural to have to stand and look at your child's lifeless body. I almost expected him to sit up and yell " psyche"!

To this day I can't stand the sight of a Highway Patrol car.

Greg

[shorty16]

Brian's Dad,

For us, it is helicopters. Flight for life was trying to land when we arrived at the scene.

We then left the scene, thinking we would meet Brian at the hospital. Mean while, the paramedics called our home to tell us to come back to the accident scene. We never got the message and 45 minutes later the helicopter came back to the hospital.....and it was empty - Flight for life does not transport dead people.

To this day, I can spot the difference between a regular helicopter, a news helicopter and flight for life. We have seen it 3X since. After each one, we called the kids to make sure they were OK.

My Brian too looked like he was sleeping. A sheet covered his body and a breathing tube was still down his throat. All the while we thought it was a head injury, because no one knew until the autopsy. That is where we found out that Brian's aorta tore from his heart, all the ribs were broken on one side, the diaphram torn, liver in pieces and sleen was not recognizable. Brian died on the side of the road within minutes of hitting the ground.

How does this happen to a perfectly healthy 16 year old boy?????

It has been over 3 years and I am still asking that question.

I am having a hard time.

Colleen, Brian's Mother Forever