Loss of an Adult Child

[summergirl]

Bonnie - LOVE the banner!!

Some of my friends went back to the cemetery the day Jessica was laid to rest and they took a bunch of the flowers and had them made into a heart shape in a beautiful heart bowl and had them preserved - they sit next to Jessica's picture - one of many that I have throughout the house.

Seems as though I have been missing out on alot of the posting but have been having such a hard time with Tavian these past days.  One minute he is fine and the next minute he has so much anger at me I don't know what to do.  He starts out by telling me he hates me, he wishes I was dead, i'm ugly, i'm NOT HIS MOM, he wishes I was in Heaven so his mommy could come back!!!  Then he goes to his room and when I go in he tells me to get out, i'm never allowed in his room - so I go to my room and sit on my bed with tears flowing as I do not know what to do - I wait a few minutes and then I hear him crying and I go in his room and he tells me he is sorry for all the bad things he said and he loves me.  Then we go through it all over again the following day - it always happens at night time and I dread when 8 o'clock comes and it is his bed time as I know what will happen and sure enough he says terrible things to me again.   I know that it is all about Jessica and I know he loves me and it is his way of getting his anger out but I am so weary of the battles - How do I make it better??  I am at a loss as to how to handle it, do I go back to therapy with him and the two of go in together - I guess I will talk again to my therapist tomorrow during our session.  I am just at the point when I never know when he is going to turn on me - we can be home, at the store, picking him up from school and I am on edge wondering if it will be a good time or an angry time.  I am so confused as to how to help him and as to what to say to him when he is screaming at me - right now I just keep telling him that no matter what he says to me or how angry he is I still love him and always will.   If anyone can help me I would so appriciate it.  I am sorry for rambeling but I am hurting and lost.

Jessica - I know that you are watching my baby so send me the energy and strength I need to help Tavian - I miss you sooooooooooo much.  My heart aches all of the time although at times I feel there is not much left of my heart - it has been broken in so many pieces by your leaving. I need you my daughter forever and always. Mom

[lostwoher]

Hmmmm-potpouri, now theres an idea i didnt come up with. I may do just that.

One reason I am grateful Kayla didnt leave behind any children. I have such a hard time dealing with my own demons that I dont think I would have it in me to deal with a hurting child. My kids were young when their father died but didnt lash out until they were pre-teens. I figured if they wanted to blame me for his death then it was time they were told the truth on why I divorced him. Not giving too many harsh details of it all but enough to let them know that his lifestyle wasnt what I had planned for our lives. Needless to say- it ended his life. I wish I had some wisdom for you but all I can come up with is for you to let him get it out the way you have been doing. How hurtful that must be for you. Yes, therapy would be excellent. Poor little guy doesnt understand any of this any more than you or I. Be strong. Im sure help is near for you and him. Hugs to ALL!

[ericasmom]

Kathy, it sounds like the two of you are really hurting, and therapy is probably the best answer right now. I know that my therapist helped me, when my kids were little, to find ways to speak that could help diffuse the anger that was directed toward me. I think that Tavian was in therapy before...why not stay in? It may be that therapy needs to be a constant for Tavian, a weekly or twice per month event to count on, even when he does not want to go. That consistency may be good for everyone. He may then find ways of coping that he tries out through the tehrapist, and reports back on these, strategies for him to deal with his outbursts. No matter what, he hurts and so do you, but it is not okay for him to rage against you. If a pattern develops for him, that you are his scapegoat, or you are his punching bag, well then it will be very hard when he is older, going through other things...a firm but not threatening response can be learned, a behavior chart, or something that let's Tavian see that you notice both the good and not so good...with built in rewards for a certain amount of good nights. At the start of using behavior charts, it is important, expecially with one so young, to have rewards built into the day of the good behavior. Even if it means he picks the sticker, he gets to have 15 minutes of extra story time, or a special breakfast the next morning if he uses good impulse control, or maybe he gets to make muffins, paint with finger paints, help build something with you, whatever it is to let him know that his good behavior is noticed and rewarded. Rewards should not be huge or you get in over your head right off the bat. If he has a good week, perhaps that could be 4 out of 5 shcool nights were good, he could pick a video for Saturday evening, or pick a special desert, or an event outside the house, A zoo trip, a hike in the woods, fishing, whatever it is that may be special. The reason these simple things can sometimes work is because the child learns that he is impacting his life with and through his choices, through his behaviors, and he is also learning tht what you said you were going to do, you do. You carry through which means when he misbehaves, you respond as you said you would, ie. no tv, no video, no zoo trip, and this means that the adults in his life mean what they say. It is essential for kids to be able to count on what is said, because if you carry through, it means he can count on you, It means that you really love him when you say it, it means that you understand that he misses Momma, it means that your words carry weight. He can count on you. I don't mean to overstate this, just have worked with a lot of kids that have issues of separation and loss, and have worked with behavior charts with some of them, and have suggested it with parents as well. There are no easy answers and I am so sorry that you are struggling with this, I applaud your effort and your energy, knowing how much that a child his age can exhaust an adult. Did you ever find out if his school has a program for kids in loss, we have them called RAINBOWS. If they do not, look it up and find out if there are any rainbows near you. When children share similar losses, they begin to see that they are not the only ones, and it opens a door for them. Have you read him any stories that involve death? I know that doesn't sound like something we want to do, but there are many good stories that can open up a dialogue for him, and once again, if the author wrote about it, it must mean that others have gone thorugh this too.

My best to you, may you all sleep well tonight. No matter how tired you are Kathy, know that you have been a great Grammy/Momma for him. Jess is holding you close as you find your way with this latest develpment.

I love the potpourri idea Bonnie, I know there were flowers galore for Eri, but I guess I did not even think of those as something to hang on to.

Peace to Each of You

[mikesmomrs]

Kathy:  My heart just aches so for you and for Tavian.  My middle daughter, Cathi's, youngest son, Jamie, who is just turned 10, is having some terrible times right now, and I just ached when she talks with me about his problems.  He's developed some severe anxiety, and has had some terrible days at school, etc., and just can't seem to get a handle on it.  He is in therapy, and it has helped some, but just as he seems to take three steps forward, he falls back two, and sometimes four!

You are doing all that you can, and as Dee said, I too applaud your efforts, your bravery and love, and continuing to let Tavian know that you love him and are there for him is likely all that you can do right now, as painful and helpless as that might feel.  I remember before when this type of thing happened, you were very distraught, but the one constant that you commited to was that you would let him know that despite his feelings and actions, etc., you would still hold onto your beliefs and limits for his behavior.  We all know this can be so very painful---but we all know it is the right thing...we just don't know how to bring it about sometimes and still let them know that we love them and are there for them.  You are in my prayers for strength and wisdom. 

Bonnie:  I also have a necklace urn of some of Mike's ashes, as well as Mike's dad, who also never wore a necklace before.  And I, too, find my fingers going towards my cross when I feel those pangs of loneliness.  My necklace is a gold cross, with Mike's dates on the crossbar, and his name down the middle.  Mike's dad's is a small urn.  Before Mike passed, we discussed with him the idea of individual "keepsake" urns, which a friend of mine had made me aware of, and he was very much for the idea, so we all have a small keepsake urn, including his children.    Bless you my friend, I can see your fingers reaching unconsiciously or consciously to make the connection to the love of your precious son... 

love and peace,  carol  mikesmomrs

[mikesmum]

Kathy - My heart broke when I read your post.  It is confusing and frustrating enough as an adult to make sense out of this journey, for Tavian and many others of a tender age it must just be insane! 

It is hard to hear his harsh words and remember he is only 6.   Harder still cause we all know that if the offer to change places was made, many of us wouldn't hesitate in taking it up.

I agree with Dee - the therapy ongoing might just be something that is part of his journey.  Not just for Tavian, but for his Mi-mi too.

I love the idea of the group called Rainbows.......never heard of it but the name and the concept bought a smile.  

The rewards and positive reinforcement concept has a proven track record.  With anything though, you need to stick with it.  Starting our small and rewarding the ongoing progess. 

Know everyone here watching Tavian grow stands in awe of the task you have taken on for your darling Jess.  Hard to be the Mi-mi/mummy when Mi-mi's heart is broken.  That energy we had as younger mothers seems at times to fail us when we need it most.   I believe Jess is around you constantly -

I send you much energy, thoughts and strengths as you face another day as 'SuperGran'.........Trudi

 

[4everjoeysmom]

Kathy, I too support the words of wisdom and encouragement that Dee shared. It is not good to allow Tavian to act out in "abusive" ways. Since it is just beginning with the bad language against you, it will be easier to deal with it through therapy and behavioral charts than it would be to try and deal with it later as the behavior becomes more learned and outwardly expressed as a normal pattern of communication. It is in Tavian's best interest and yours to be "firm" with him in leading him to understand that the behavior is unacceptable regardless of the circumstances of life. It may be more difficult in the short term, but he will thank you when he is older, as he will be better equipped to deal with other life challenges in a healthy way. Even if he doesn't thank you, you will have the peace in knowing that you truly made a tough choice for his good and for the sake of him being able to express emotions in a healthy way when he is older as well. Too many times kids are allowed to express emotions in a wrong way because we don't want to be too hard on them given what they are facing in life. But not addressing it now can lead to abuse toward his girlfriends, wife, children, etc when he is older if it isn't checked now. It's difficult to envision that far down the road when we are dealing with difficulties like this in children, but you have to be firm in your teaching him the right and wrong way to express emotions. A therapist should be able to help tremendously in this area as well. It is a lot for your broken heart to deal with. But remember Tavian is NOT rejecting you. He needs you. He loves you. He misses his mommy.

I also would monitor closely in a journal his behavior patterns before and after visits with his paternal grandmother and disney-dad. It may be that something there is triggering more negative feelings and emotions that he is having difficulty understanding and discussing with you. It seems you shared recently that some trouble in his behavior became pronounced after his last visit with her. If that would continue or escalate, I think I would seek a court order for them to be involved in the counseling as well, and/or that they be only allowed supervised visits, with cyclical evaluations.

Just some thoughts/ideas I wanted to share, and to let you know how much I too admire your courage and perseverance. Jessica would very much approve of everything and anything that would be in her son's very best interest. This, you know.

Hugs and much love, Claudia

[mamabets]

For summergirl~ I "ditto" all...Counseling, and DEFINATELY with Tavian's other family members!! If he is troubled now, and if he is with others that claim to love him, and are a part of his life team, they too need to be involved with this process..

Easy for me to say, as I have an ex husband/his wife, that CLEARLY did NOT want me involved, except when they felt like it...Here we are today!

My parenting skills have always been buffed and polished, and they resented it...

But, unacceptable, locking eyes, and discipline are, unfortunately, part of the whole package...

It is VERY hard to carry through with our grandbabies, especially under these circumstances. This is where the counseling will really help!

Also, there is a journal for kids that could REALLY help...I'll post the picture- You could do the "big people" one, Tavian could do the "little guy" one!!

Something that you could share when these times with him are calm and full of cozy love~ It might help to distract from the anger...

I HOPE and PRAY!!!!

LOVE

mamabets

[mamabets]

For summergirl~ Here is a picture of the one for the big people...I have one, given to me by Danny's girlfriend, and it was an amazing project...Truly, a labor of the deepest love, and I cherish it. Jackie has one too...xo 

Perhaps you could call the local book store, have them order them if they don't have both, and then you and Tavian go and pick them up together~

LOVE

mamabets

[daniellemom]

Summergirl,

What everyone has told you is so true, but hard. My prayers will be with you both as you work the lastest things out. Know that whatever you decide to do will be the right thing and what Jessica would have wanted.

Love the shoe idea also, Danielle always loved her skips as she called them.

Sonya (Danielle's Mom)

[briansdad]

Kathy,

I lost my Dad when I was only 7 and yes I had extreme anger issues. Take heart. It will get better. Keep going to the therapist and keep loving him no matter how hard it is.Losing a parent at a young age is almost as hard as losing a child. It will take a while but please know in your heart that any of the bad things he says he doesn't mean. You just are just a convenient target.

Greg

 

[heartbeataway]

Greg,

Great advice from someone who knows.  I thought about you yesterday and wondered if you were in the background reading but not saying too much  ......

Hope you're okay ......

Bonnie

[daveydow1]

Kay,

 I too wish to say that your son, Johnny, looks so nice and proud

in his uniform. I know you are so proud of him, and I pray that

you were able to get through Veterans Day ok....a very difficult

day for you, I'm sure. Peace and prayers.

               Sherry    

[daveydow1]

Kay,

 I too wish to say that your son, Johnny, looks so nice and proud

in his uniform. I know you are so proud of him, and I pray that

you were able to get through Veterans Day ok....a very difficult

day for you, I'm sure. Peace and prayers.

               Sherry    

[summergirl]

Hello to all - I can't tell you all how much I cried when I read your postings - it is exactly what I needed!!!  First thing - I went to therapy today and she told me she is leaving her East Hampton practice and remaining with the one in the city, she only comes out here on Wednesdays and it is too much for her to keep both places going, too many people. I was very upset but understand - we will continue the therapy through e-mails and she will see me once a month when she comes for a weekend so that is the bad news. The good news is she told me that everything Tavian is doing is "normal" for his age and for what he has been through. I am the closest one to him so I am the target and since he never had a "dad" then Barry is not the problem. She told me the same as all of you - that I need to remain firm with him and that unacceptable behavior needs to be dealt with firmly but not abusive.    I love the idea of the behavior chart and am going to make one tomorrow, we had actually talked about doing that but having read what you sad Dee just reinforced the point. My therapist also said that I need to let Barry take over when Tavian is out of control with me. He can come in and say something like "mi-mi, why don't you go have a cup of tea because Tavian and I are going to spend some time together" and then I remove myself from the situation until he calms down.  I know that I tend to let my feeling of losing Jessica come into the picture when he begins to scream at me and say such mean things and I need to let go of that, I need to remember that she is not here and it is up to me on how to handle the situation. I believe she is all around me and I know she gives me strength, otherwise I would be sitting in the white room with a straight jacket on by now!!!!

mamabets - thank you for the idea of the Angel journals - I am going to go to Amazon and see if they have them or my local book store. Tavian loves to do projects and this sounds like something we can both do together - you are so sweet.

Dee - what can I say - you are one of the best with words and I treasure every thought you have for me, you go right to the heart of everything and you have saved me in more ways then I can say.  Yes, they have "Rainbows" at Tavian's school and he goes once a week.  How right you are when you say "it I carry through then he can count on me" - you did not overstate anything.  Thank you so much.

Sonya - thank you for keeping me in your prayers and thoughts.

Carol - I have such sympthy for your little Jamie, I know what his mom is going through and it is so hard. Tavian also has "days" at school so his teacher did a chart for the three of us - each day he either gets a smiley face for a great day, a sad face for a bad day or a frown for an ok day - since she began the chart he is only had one sad face and all others have been smiley!!  I also understand the taking 3 steps forward and 5 backwards - I just told Barry the other night that it feels as though Tavian has went back almost a year - when I mentioned it to my therapist she said he has not retreated backwards he is just getting older and realizing that he doesn't really remember that much of his mommy so he is learning to let go of the past and move forward, a very tough thing for a little guy. It is very painful to have to punish him as your heart says "hasn't he been punished enough by losing his mommy" but the mind knows that he needs the punishment in order to grow and have respect for himself and others. I wish your daughter luck and I know with you helping her all will turn out ok - God Bless you.

Greg - thank you so much - it is definitely wonderful to have a man's point of view, especially since you lost your dad at such a young age - your words touched my heart and I thank you for that.

Trudi - Yes, if the offer were made I would not hesitate, unfortunately I do not have that choice as we all know to well. I am determined to see this all through one day at a time and as you say "start out small and reward the ongoing progress".  I am the one who is in awe of all of you - the words, the strength, the compassion, the love I feel from all of you remains with me through out the hardest times and that is what makes me the person I am - without you I would not be able to move on as I have. My dear friend, a walk at the beach listening to the pounding waves is just what I need.

Once again thank you and God Bless all of you. Tomorrow will be a better day!!

 This is a picture of my dad "the farmer" and Tavian out at the place where my brother is buried - it is in the country and over looks a huge valley - so beautiful and peaceful - this one was taken on the side where there are cows that roam around (fenced in) and Tavian and my dad were looking at the different berries that were growing.  Hope it comes out.

[ericasmom]

Kathy,

the photo is great, Tavian is certainly growing, and is still a picture of his Momma. I am glad that you feel some resolve today, I know that the hard days can be VERY difficult to handle emotionally. My Daughter, ERica, hated school, and while she was not grieving, she was reacting to this standard that she could not reach. She was angry, I was it for her anger. As though I had a target drawn on me, and she knew just how to hit the center each time, until I learned a bit about diffusing her anger, turning her words around so that she could hear them...it was through the help of a dear therapist that I found help with that. I also had to learn how to remove myself from the situation, not feed it. Your husband going in to tell you to have a cup of tea is a perfect transition.

I printed out the page about the journal for kids who love someone who has died. I am going to give that to our Social Worker and see if she has used them before. She runs Rainbows, I will see if the ERica Reith Fund should purchase some for the kids who are grieving. Thanks for the idea.

Dee

[ericasmom]

Claudia...

how was the retreat? I have missed you and the charming face of Joe.

Dee

[4everjoeysmom]

Kathy, Aside from the trees being colorful and of a different type (ours are always green and a little more tropical of type--like rubber and palms), that photo looks like it could have been taken in my side yard. We have wild berries and flowers everywhere, and that same kind of barbed wire fence to keep the neighboring cows at bay. Sweet photo of Tavian and your dad!

Dee, The retreats went well. I had 37 women and three guys here the weekend before, and 44 men and 2 women this past weekend. I had two full time kitchen helpers and one part time helper for the mornings until after lunch. I was amazed at how much this group ate. We went through 5 pounds of rice per meal, along with 9 very large whole chickens, one gigantic meatloaf, 20 pounds of potatoes and lots of other meat and food stuffs. I made bread pudding with peaches, raisins and a raspberry sauce. It was a big hit. We cooked non-stop, and then there was clean up, washing dishes and resetting tables between each meal. That was my end. The folks who enjoyed the retreat had a wonderful time here and profound spiritual experiences as well. It's the norm here, it seems. Everyone that comes out here seems to find a personally deep encounter of some kind that changes the way they look at things. And of course they are fed well.

I hadn't been online for a few days--too many hours on my feet and too tired when it was all over. But I have been reading to catch up. It's so wonderful to see how everyone comes together in support of one who is having a troubled time, no matter what the situation is.... I'm so blessed by all of you.........

Hugs,

Claudia

[johnnysmama]

Dee and Sherry

Thanks for the sweet words about Johnny.

 

Kathy

All the wisdom here to help with Tavian. I really cant add anything. His anger is the result of his feelings of saddness-at that age they have very little control or knowledge of how to feel better-so it comes out in anger. You are doing everything right and the best thing you are doing is seeking out ways to help him learn how to cope with his feelings so he wont have so much pent up anger. He must really get lonely for his Mom at night when it is quieter and all the school hub bub is over. Actually, his anger is sort of good as it is a release just not an appropriate one but better than him holding it in and isolating himself. Remember, Moms are ALWAYS the puching bag as they know we can be such softies and that we love them so much. My 17 year old has really isolated herself and sometimes worries me. We forced herto go look at colleges with us and for the first time in 20 months she is talking about moving forward, getting college app stuff together and her grades went from a 2.8 to a 3.6! We still have a ways to go but I do see her starting to move thru losing her brother to taking care of herself again. We just love our kids and grandkids so much dont we? Actually, by Stephanie being troubled it has made me quit being in a pity party for myself so much and start trying to be a better Mom to her. It is sooo hard when I am struggling but I have to do it for her. Her sister is in a ballet company and I think the dancing 3 hours 6 days a week has been her salvation. Emily also just got her driving license tonight after 2 tries! She was so happy. I must admit it worries me but I have to let her go...

 

Claudia

You do the most amazing hard work. It moves me everytime you talk about it. Feel free to tell more.

 

Dee

How are things with Michael?

 

Lorri and Lynn

How are you 2 doing?

 

Wishing you some peaceful moments,

Kay

 

 

[lostwoher]

Im here just not saying much. Yesterday was Kayla's 3 month angel day. Apparently my mood showed while at work because I was asked if it was an important day by a co-worker. Jen is my shoulder while working as she lost her brother 2 years ago. She lent me her shoulder once again and helped me make it thru the day. I also recieved a call from my older sis that she became a gma once again. All I could think was how could they have a baby on this day? Its Kayla's day! Dont take that away from me. Silly o me. I guess life does go on. Strange part of the birth was that the umbilical cord was wrapped around his neck 3 times and he had lots of fluid in his lungs. I can only think that Kayla did her angel duty for him so he could come into this world and bring the love she cant give. I havent gone to see the lil guy yet but am told all is well and should be released from the hospital tomorrow.

   Hope all is well with everyone.

Love n hugs,

Lynn

[lolynbo]

IM READING EVERYONES POST BUT JUST KINDA HANGING OUT...EVERY TIME I LOOK UP THAT BLACK CLOUD IS ABOVE ME...WENT TO WALMART TODAY AND RAN INTO "KOURTNEYS BEST FRIEND" WITH HER NEW BABY...I DIDNT HOLD IT, BUT DID LOOK AT IT AND TOUCH IT...IM JUST NOT READY.....THEN ON THE WAY HOME FROM MY DAILY CEMETARY VISIT I SEE KOURTNEYS HUSBANDS TRUCK AT HIS NEW "GIRLFRIENDS " HOUSE (KOURTNEYS FRIEND)...YA IT HURTS....I WANTED TO TEXT HIM BUT DIDNT I JUST WENT HOME...

IT IS JUST GOING TO BE REALLY HARD FOR US AROUND HERE FOR THE NEXT FEW MONTHS...

HOPE ALL IS WELL FOR ALL OF YALL AND THANK YOU FOR CAREING

[heartbeataway]

Time is too slow for those who wait, too swift for those who fear, too long for those who grieve, too short for those who rejoice, but for those who love, time is eternity.   

~Henry Van Dyke

Just sharing something I read today and thought you might enjoy reading it also......

[ericasmom]

Claudia, what amazing work indeed, I agree with Kay. How satisfying it must feel when you join with so many around a meal after a day or two or more of great spiritual connection. Lovely. Thanks for making the world a bit more peaceful.

Kay, I will pray for Stephanie, that she continue to find her stride adn her path as the sister of her beloved Johnny. It is a less recognized and less written about condition, being without a sibling. The issues they carry and the inablility at times for us to help as we are ourselves in despair. Please don't beat yourself up though, I wouldn't say that you were in a pity party, more a hell-hole that you are finding your way out of. It takes a lot of strength Kay, you are leading by example now. WOW for Stephanie, to raise her grade point average that much in  this amount of time. Good for her. She may want to go to a college close by, just feeling a bit nervous about being away, or she may just go away and try it all at once. I celebrate her looking forward.

Michael is not good today, because of his chemo, he is nutripenic, weak, bloody nose, and they wanted to give him chemo for the brain cancer through the spine but a previous back surgery prevented this as he has a plate in his back. So tomorrow, he'll go to radiology to see if they can feed it through his spine around the plate...if not the chemo has to be delivered through the skull, and this is terrifying. So we are scared for him, wishing him to feel better again. Oh Lord, if miracles are out there for him, he is ready. Jonathan is exhuasted but he is with his Dad each day and that is good. I know it gives Michael comfort, and along the way, Jon will know that he supported his Dad very well. Thanks for the prayers, please continue.

Bonnie, thanks, I have read this one before, but it is always beautiful and beneficial to read again. Thanks,

Lynn, hang tight, those anniversaries, very hard to deal with, three months was a hard time for me, it was when I found this place, thank heavens.

God Bless All,

Dee

[heartbeataway]

Did anyone watch ER tonight?

A very moving program.  We don't normally watch it.  It was about the loss of a child.

Some things that stood out to me:

When a wife loses a husband she's a widow. When a husband loses a wife he's a widower. There's no name for a parent who loses a child ......

She couldn't get past wanting to be where he is, to touch him, to smell him , to hold him.

She was willing to give up whatever the future held to be with her son .....

[lostwoher]

I use to be an avid watcher of ER but hadnt seen much of the last 3 seasons. Needless to say I tuned in after hearing that 'Mark Green' was making a return. Im sure I cried during the last half hour. So touching and true turmoil. I felt her every pain. Oh and the phrase about no word to call a parent who has lost a child-why is that? I never thought of that before but it is so true. Once a parent, always a parent.

Thoughts, prayers and well wishes to Michael and everyone in between.

The holidays are fast approaching and Im not sure what to do. I have always cooked the big meal for Kayla and Brian but this year it will just be Randy and I. He suggested going out for Thanksgiving dinner but I dont want changes because it will only remind me that 'things' are different. I have had more than enough change in my life this past year. On the other hand, I dont want to sit around here with a ton of food going to waste only wishing she would get here and help clean up- lol. So many thoughts I cant keep them all straight tonite.

Sleep well my friends,

        Lynn

[ericasmom]

Lori and Lynn, look and see, your girls are letting you know that life does go on, as you said Lynn, it goes on in the births of babies, the firsts for those parents and your girls are cheering for them, happy for them. New life has a way of reminding us that we will always be parents, that we will always have children and no matter what or how we lost our Children, the sound and smell of new babies is something we know, we will always know. Yes, we ache from all that has been delivered to us, but life has to go on, and in it, our Babies rejoice.

Love ya, and hope that the black clouds are swept away for a glimpse of the sun, a lighter day tomorrow. Remember, sometimes it is one hour at a time.

Dee

[mikesmomrs]

I also used to be an avid watcher of ER, but when Mike became ill, I just couldn't stand the proximity to the "hospital-ness" of the show, so I quit watching.  I did know the story of Dr. Green, though, and had intended to watch tonight, but forgot. 

the statement you quoted, Bonnie, "She couldn't get past wanting to be where he is, to touch him, to smell him , to hold him" seared my very soul...Those first days, weeks, months after Mike died, my daily scream to heaven was "DON'T JUST TELL ME HE IS OKAY, SHOW ME!  Let me SEE him, please, please, please, let me hold him, touch him, smell him..."  and I would dissolve into a teary, shaking mess.  My faith was there; I know that is what got me through each day, but my "mother-ness" demanded more.  Can you imagine?  Me DEMANDING something from God!?!? 

Dee, continuing to send prayers your way, wrapping you and Michael and Jon in strength and hugs...I am so very sorry to hear that they are having to do extra to get the chemo to Michael. 

I haven't posted a lot lately; this move has me in a whirlwind of "stuff," stuff I am having second thoughts about even needing...lol!  But, I come on and read, and sahre your words, and you, as always, all are in my prayers daily.

love and peace,  carol  mikesmomrs

 

[lolynbo]

KOURTNEYS TRUE TWO GOOD FRIENDS CAME OVER LAST NIGHT AND WE ALL WENT THROUGH HER CLOTHES...THEY LAUGHED AT WHEN THEY HAD WENT SHOPPING AND WHEN THEY BOUGHT THIS AND THAT....THEY BOTH LEFT WITH LARGE BLACK TRASH BAGS FULL AND I STILL HAVE BOXES OF STUFF TO DONATE TO KOURTNEYS KLOSET....SHE LOVED CLOTHES...

BUT IT HIT ME WHAT TO DO WITH HER WEDDING DRESS....ONE OF THE TWO GIRLS (THEY ARE SISTERS) ISNT MARRIED AND I ASKED HER WHEN SHE GETS MARRIED WOULD SHE WEAR KOURTNEYS DRESS...SHE STARTED TO CRY AND SAID YES...SO WE HAVE FOUND A HOME FOR THE WEDDING DRESS..SHE IS SO EXCEITED...IT IS A VERY UNUSUAL DRESS...WHITE WITH SOME BLACK AND SIVER UNDER THE UNDERSIDE...ABSOLUTELY BEAUTIFUL...KOURTNEY SAID "MOM, I FOUND THE DRESS AND THE GUY YOU DO EVERYTHING ELSE" AND I DID...I HAVE A PIC BUT IT WONT LOAD ITS TOO BIG BUT I WILL TRY AGAIN SOMETIME..

HAVE A BLESSED DAY

[briansdad]

 

ANOTHER CHRISTMAS WITHOUT YOU

I'm reading this poem at our BP USA candlelight on Dec. 2 . I wish I could say that I wrote it but I can't, but it sure fits our situations.

Take Care

Greg

 

The snow is falling gently on this December morn.

I seek the warmth of time before when memories weren’t so worn

Remembering in Christmas past how festive all would be.

But celebrating still does not come easily for me.

 

Sweet child of mine I know that you would want me to partake

In all the season offers and give thanks for heavens sake

I’m getting there but thanks is something hard for me to do

When all I see is spending another Christmas without you.

 

I’ll do better next year, I know you’ve heard that before

But it seems each year I do take part in Christmas a little more.

There was a time when you first left I simply hid away

Now look at me out shopping and it’s almost Christmas Day

 

Sweet child of mine I do the best I can to carry on

But Christmas just isn’t Christmas since you’ve been gone

It has lost the magic and there’s nothing I can do

But do my best spending another Christmas without you.

 

Merry Christmas B,

Love, Dad

 

[heartbeataway]

Lynn,

Bless your heart!  The holidays will never be the same to me but this is how we handled our first Thanksgiving without Jay.

We invited as many folks as would come.  This wasn't my idea. Actually, my sister instigated the whole thing. She and her husband came from Virginia and I had a nephew and his family come from Oklahoma....  etc....

To include Jay, I put a framed poem on the table that my sister-in-law gave me with a small picture of Jason and a small candle. 

I was so busy all day with the preparation and the number of people that I didn't have time to sit and just think.

The ticker tape in my mind, Jay would just love this, kept playing over and over but it didn't disable me.

He would have loved the day with family and friends.  He would have helped clean up and when I was at the kitchen sink, he would have walked up to me and put his arm around me and he would have said, "Mom, you're the best.  I love you."

I live in Texas, you are more than welcome to come to our house for Thanksgiving!

Bonnie

[heartbeataway]

Carol,

I remember those days that followed Jay's death.  I just wanted to be with him. I wanted a child so badly and when I got pregnant with Jason, my prayers had been answered.

Then right when things were getting ready to burst wide open with the future ...

marriage, grandchildren, expanding his business, moving ....... he was gone.

I have to admit, I struggled to continue.  Rich helped me realize that I loved more in life than Jason and my heaven sent counselor helped me realize that there is another dimension to me than just a Mom.

Jason's business has been a diversion that at first was overwhelming and not necessarily wanted.  Our business plans included him ........ he owned and ran the business.  But, now it's a connection to him and his sense of pride, his integrity and his ethics. He was all and more than we thought he was.

Your thoughts were I need to know he's okay and my thoughts were, bring him back.  If you can take him away, you can bring him back.  And then I had my dream where he was learning to fly with his new wings.  And the one where he walked up to me and hugged me close.  He patted my back telling me it's going to be okay.  I could feel him, the stubble on his face, I could feel the warmth of his body and feel his hands on my back.

Those are the brief moments of time that keep me going ...... my elusive dreams.

bonnie

[mikesmomrs]

Greg, Tears are falling as I read the poem you posted....it is SO descriptive of, I am sure, how we ALL feel.  I will read that at our candlelighting ceremony as well.  I don't know how I will get through it, but I know that Mike will help me and that God will send the strength I need, just as He always has.  Thanks for sharing.

love and peace, Carol  mikesmomrs

[ericasmom]

Greg it is a beautiful poem, one that brought tears to my eyes, extra beats to my heart. You will touch everyone in that room with those words that I too, wished I had written.

Bonnie, it warms me to read that you found that you are multi-faceted, that you are other things besides a MOther, though Lord knows, that heading is your favorite. Mine too. I remember the first dream that was a visit, and I have had probably 9 r so of those, each time being refreshed, born anew. I could hear ERi's voice, I was able to hold her in her toddler days, and then again on my lap when she was about 8 or 9. I got to see and hear her and hold her large hands as the young adult she is/was/is. I love the dreams and the visits, and while they are never as often as I wish, I am quite blessed by each one.I have had dreams that are also dreadfully sad, and while I ache with the details of those dreams, there is usually some message within that I need to discover.

I remember the first Thanksgiving without my Girl. I wrote a poem about the light from the homes on the block, how it reflected on the sidewalk where I stood listening to the joyous gatherings, where I no longer fit because I lived where there was an empty chair. I have however enjoyed the holidays again, just differently. I know that for those of you facing your first holiday time without your Child, it is daunting but we are here as proof that you will also get through this. Reach out for those that can help, they often don't know what to do until you let them know. I know that I am amazed at the love at this address, and I give thanks for all of you and all of the Children, each day.

Lori, it is a good thing to share the goods/artifacts from your Daughter's life. To know that her favorite things will be handled and cared for by people she loved, and by people who are in need...goes a long way to making your spirit feel some lightness.

Peace to all,

Dee

PS Carol, you rest, of course you are a bit off kilter after so much change and the holidays on top of it all, you rest and let things fall into place. Sometimes we underestimate what we do to prepare.

[mikesmum]

This journey has taught me much and the lessons are paid forward in many many ways. 

My son-in-law lost a friend a couple of months ago.  They grew up together, their parents close friends.  Ironically Jeremy had lost his dad when he was young, this lad his mum.  Last week Melissa was telling me how this boys father was struggling with the loss of his son.  It was coming up on his birthday, its the year of firsts.  "I sent him your poem Just for Today, I thought it would help".  (I did enlighten her to the fact that I hadn't written it).

Greg, I will pass ANOTHER CHRISTMAS WITHOUT YOU on to Melissa so she may in turn give it to this boys dad. 

Take Care - Thinking of you all as you head into Thanksgiving.

Trudi 

[daveydow1]

Kathy,

What a wonderful candid photo of your dad and Tavian out and enjoying

the countryside. Tavian certainly looks like he was having fun. The

relationship between him and his  grt-grandfather is indeed very special.

Peace to all your family.

                    Daveysmom,   Sherry

[heartbeataway]

Greg,

I couldn't finish reading the poem the first time.  When I got to "Sweet Child of Mine", I clicked out of it.

I still remember the day that Jay called me to his bedroom to hear the song of the same name by Guns n Roses. 

I finished it tonight and I've printed it and forwarded a copy to Rich.

Thanks Greg ........

Bonnie

We had a tradition of taking a Christmas family picture and putting it in a Christmas frame.  That makes such a neat display of Christmas through the years.  I will put this poem in a frame and if (when) I'm ever strong enough to get the collection out again, this poem will be there amongst the pictures.

[daniellemom]

Thank you go out to everyone who responsed to James' questions. It was so nice of you to take the time to answer and revisit those first thoughts of the greatest loss. Thanks again.

Lynn, with the holidays approaching do what you think you can. Thanksgiving last year was just a little over a month after we lost Danielle and we had lunch at my sisters and it was also James' birthday so we tried to be happy for James' birthday but mostly we just cried. Do what you think you can and if you can't at the last minute that's ok to.

Greg, The poem was great, thanks for sharing.

As always Dee your words are so true and help me so much. My prayers are still with Michael and Jon.

Kay - How are you doing. It's great that your daughter has stared to look at colleges. James is a freshman and he is doing great. Can't wait to hear where she decides to go.

Oh, I going to check on a tatoo today they are drawing me a few different things for me to pick from. I hope I don't chicken out about getting one. I think I will get the tatoo in a few weeks.

Sonya (Danielle's Mom)

[lolynbo]

TODAY IS THE DAY A YR AGO I LAST HEARD KOURTNEYS VOICE...HER TUMOR BURST...SO ITS GOING TO BE A HARD ONE..

RAN INTO A SO CALLED "FRIEND" YEST SHE WAS TELLIN ME HOW HARD ITS BEEN FOR HER LOSING KOURTNEY AND THAT IM IN HER PRAYERS AND SHE PRAYS FOR ME ALL THE TIME...NOW THIS HAS BEEN GOING ON A YR NOW WITH KOURTNEY AND SHE HAS BEEN GONE 5 MONTHS THE 17TH...I HAVE GOTTEN 3 TEXT MESSAGES FROM THIS FRIEND THIS WHOLE TIME....WHY DO PPL LIKE THIS EVEN BOTHER...SHE DIDNT EVEN KNOW WHERE SHE IS BURIED BECAUSE THE FUNERAL WAS TOOOOO HARD ON HER....."WE GOTTA GET TOGETHER HAVE DRINKS YOU NO US FREINDS HAVE TO STICK TOGETHER"  GIVE ME A BRAKE....IM SOOOOO SICK OF FRIENDS...I NO WHO MY FRIENDS ARE...

[heartbeataway]

Lorri,

I'm not defending the person you ran into but I will say that some folks honestly don't know what to do, so they stay away.

It wasn't until recently that I saw a friend and she still couldn't keep her composure.

She didn't want to upset me.

There are close friends, there are distant friends and there are folks who are merely acquaintances who consider themselves friends.

Try not to let this upset you.

The last thing Jay said to me was, "I love you Mom".  This was on Thursday afternoon. He was in a shop having a repair done on his jeep before he left on his camping trip Friday.  It was noisy so he said that he would call me later.  I told him no, to just wait until Monday and he could tell me how his weekend went.  He died Saturday morning.

We just never know ........

Bonnie

[mikesmum]

Its funny how this grief thing works.  Mike was 31 when he left.  His circle of friends had moved on from when they would come to our house as young people.  Marriage, careers etc had scattered many to the wind.  All but one or two came to his funeral.  There were many 'we'll have to catch up - see you soon, I'll call you were said that day'.  Only one or two have stuck to that offer. 

I run into them occassionaly and we chat about where they are now and what their future plans are.  We can do that now, I am in a better place to hear them.  Anytime they find old pictures with Mike in them they email.

As for my "true friends"  Well my best friend supported us through those first days.  She baked for Mikes wake, she made a handpainted glass memorial, she wrote poetry for him.  When I didn't return to my old self after a couple of months later, going shopping, doing lunches etc, she was offended, "she'd done so much for me".  She did send an email outlining her hurt.  She needed a friend, someone she could count on and I was letting her down.  We last spoke in May 07. 

Like Bonnie says  "some folks honestly don't know what to do, so they stay away".  They just might not know how to approach or what to say and to be honest depending on where you are on this journey it can be hard to know where you are yourself.

I hope the next days months are easier on you.  It isn't a journey that can be easily navigated.  It has many ups & downs twists and turns.  When it takes me for a ride, I find here is the best place to be.......Trudi

[mikesmomrs]

Just wanted to share:

I don’t know if it’s the move, my exhaustion brought about by the move, the time of year, or a mixture of all of these, but these past couple of weeks I have found myself awash in periods of crying, remembering, sorrowing.  I’ve tried to come out of it, and thankfully, I have succeeded to a degree, periodically.  Today, hubby and I decided to just wade through some of the boxes, one at a time, that have been sitting there, at least until we had emptied all of those pertaining to the kitchen.  After a hard day of work, we decided to run out to Wendy’s for supper, rather than have to cook and then clean up.  We thought about going to a restaurant to just sit and be waited on, but we both just wanted to come back to the house quickly and try to relax.  While out, one of my periods of crying took over.  From out of nowhere, I started questioning again how we can know if our son is okay, how can we just “trust” that he is doing okay, questioning all the “signs” we’ve seen from him, the hearts, the rainbows, the phone messages, the 1975 pennies (1975 being the year Mike was born), wondering how we can fit these “signs” in with our faith, etc., etc.  Of course, we all know that the wondering is endless, and when we start it’s hard to stop.  So I cried some more, right there underneath the bright lights of Wendy’s, in the middle of their supper hour.  When I finally calmed down to the point where I was just wiping tears, I remembered the four pennies given to me in my change when I paid for our dinner a few minutes earlier.  I pulled them from my pocket, and in the midst of three shiny pennies, was one dulled by handling and time, 33 years to be exact…1975; the year Mike was born.

 

Love and Peace to all tonight,

carol  mikesmomrs

[ericasmom]

And so there he was, holding you as you wept, happy that you remembered to look, looking for a confirmation, hoping for that undeniable sense of his presence.

 

He is always watching over you, now lay down and get some rest.

Love,

Dee

[heartbeataway]

Carol,

My thought this morning was to login and post hoping that everyone had a good restful night.

Bless your broken heart!

I know what you mean.  I haven't moved but I'm finding times tough right now. I've blamed it on the holidays coming ....... those dreaded use to be happy times.

Our sign from Jason are large birds soaring through the sky.  Or a black Corvette. We seldom see Rubicon's here in Texas.

I had a crying jag in the local Walmart the other day.  I was buying a birthday card for the young man, one of Jay's best friends that was going to be best man at his wedding. I looked up and I was confronted with Happy Birthday Son cards.  I just stood there and cried.  I still have the last birthday card we bought for him. 

Remember he died in April and his birthday wasn't until October.  But, when I found what I thought was the perfect card, I grabbed it and saved it.

You've been forced to walk down memory lane in the middle of the holiday chaos.  You've left the house with so many memories..... good and bad, of your precious boy.

It's almost like we get "grief sickness" when we go through too many e"motions" of the grief that lives with us.  When the e"motions" settle for a little while then so will our thoughts, tears and fears.

I do know what you mean. There are times when I've been needing contact of some kind with Jay so bad I physically ache with the pain. I think I miss his voice the most. If I could talk to him, I think it would be easier to live without his physical presence.  At least that's how I feel right now.

We are blessed with those who understand ........ can you imagine how much harder this journey would be if we didn't have our keyboards with someone on the other end of the connection?

Blessings to you today as you continue unpacking your life and settling into to your new place.  Your memories will settle in with you ..... just give it a little time.

Love!

[bbarbie55]

I'm glad I'm not the only one that has moments in walmart and other places. I guess we do really need this web site more now than ever. It still seems like yesterday and it was also in April of 2007 I lost my Bobbi. She tried to warn me it could happen to her in the short time she had her cancer but you are never prepared for it even though I had dreams about it.

Not looking forward to the holidays.

Deb

[johnnysmama]

Carol

I soooo understand where you are. I am so sorry. I have been having these "hard" cries lately, too. I think it is the reality settling in and the holidays fast approaching. It is a pit in my heart right now. You have all the moving exhaustion on top of it. Do something nice for yourself. You deserve it and Mike wants you too. He is with you showering you with money and love. I ordered a dress. I hardly ever wear one as I am a bit of a tom boy and I am on the floor most of the day with 5 year olds. I have gained 30 pounds this last 20 months. I said enough. Bad enough to feel sad about Johnny don't need my clothes to not fit, too. So this dress is a size smaller than I can wear now. I told my husband "Game on". He booked a cruise for just us 2 for the day after Christmas-hence the need for a dress for our 25 th wedding anniversary. No girls he said-they are staying home(weird for me my kids do everything with us). He said if we make it through the holidays we deserve to get away. We cant really afford it but oh well money isnt important anymore. So do something for Carol. Take care of you. Know we are here.

Wishing you some peace and REST,

Kay

[ericasmom]

Hooray for you Kay. What color is your dress? Are you excited? Sounds like the husband is looking to find ways to step forward wtih you. HOw nice, hope it all feels right.

Hey, do you ever get the dreaded head lice.Yes, ladies and gentlemen, I am dealing with 8 loads of laundry to get rid of what is making my scalp itch; head lice. And Iwill be spending most of the day getting rid of them. Good Lord, I hate these. I never got them as a kid myself, but boy the school I am at I get them far too often. No more hugging the kids, and inOak Park, the parents like to do everything holistic or organic, adn head lice respond only to chemicals.

ICK!

Dee

[heartbeataway]

Kay,

What a great plan!  Share your dieting secrets with me ..... I've also gained weight in the last 18 months.  Just one more thing to deal with.  We have a Leadership meeting to go to for my husbands company in February.  It's in Mexico. We are the oldest couple so no pressure there .....

Dee, little critters running around your head ....... I agree.... eck!!!  But yes I do remember them.  Isn't that a part of going to school?  Like an initiation or something?

Still praying for your boys ........

Carol,

Better day?

Claudia,

How are the new pups doing?  We need pictures once you're rested.

Lorri,

Are you doing okay?

Trudi,

I mailed the book and CD.  Sorry it took me so long ........

My camera still has not arrived from Virginia.  It was mailed on the 5th .... and it's totally ticking me off!

I'm actually cleaning today.  For me, that's a GIANT step forward ..... ;-)

Love!

[daniellemom]

Carol, I'm so glad you found the penny, Mike was right with you.

Bonnie, Can't wait to see the pictures.

Dee, head lice I remember Danielle kept them in the 4th grade, I would clean and clean and treat her long hair and within two weeks she would have them again. Good luck with getting "rid" of them.

Kay, What great news about the trip I so hope you have a nice time. Good luck with the diet, I also need your tips!!

Love and prayers to all,

Sonya (Danielle's Mom)

[daveydow1]

mikesmomrs, Carol,

I believe that it was a sign from dear Mike that you received a

penny with  1975  on it.  I can so relate to your crying in Wendy's.

Not too long after David's death, my husband and I went to a restaurant

and after being served our meal, I found a lump that seemed the size

of a baseball in my throat, and could not swallow. Tears followed.

Needless to say, I couldn't eat the food. It was just too soon. That was

5 yrs. ago, but I still remember it vividly. We must keep believing that

our children are in a good place-----they were, after all, good people.....

dearly loved forevermore.

Peace &  prayers.

                       Daveysmom, Sherry 

[daveydow1]

mikesmum, Trudi,

I think that when friends shy away, or just drop out of the radar, that

they are thinking more of how our child's death affects  THEM, or our

friendships BEFORE our dear child's passing.  In other words, it's about

THEM, not us.  I have had that experience also---although not exactly.

A particular friend was distant after Davey's death---not calling, or even

attending the wake. After a year, I called this "friend", and was treated

rudely, as though my call was unwelcome.  It took me awhile, but I came

to the conclusion that I am better off without the them. It has been 4 yrs.

now----no communication whatsoever----and I can say I am relieved. I have

let it go. Who needs friends like that? Maybe you will reconcile with this

friend of yours, or maybe not. Whichever way it turns out, you deserve so

much credit for living each day in the most devastating life event that

any parent will ever face. Peace to you & prayers.

                            Daveysmom,  Sherry

[mikesmomrs]

Dee:  Ugh!  Head lice...oh, I feel so badly for you!  But yes, very much a part of growing up...My younger daughter had long, long (down to her waist) hair, but I was lucky enough that she only picked them up twice.  Mike, however, worked in Spencer's at the mall for a couple of years, and they were required to wear the silly hats, etc., especially at Halloween.  His wife had thick, thick, long, red wiry hair, and of course, Mike got them from the hats and she got them from him.  THREE TIMES in less than three months!  He finally shaved his head (at the time he was wearing almost a 'fro) and she said after the third time that if they came back, she was going to shave her head, as well.  Mike told his boss no more hats, and luckily they never came back.  Mike and his wife were living with us at the time, so of course, I pitched in to help them with the chemicals, and the combing, and the misery!  Oh my gosh, it's hard to believe that happened 13 years ago!!!  

(I was just interrupted by a call from a close friend of mine who is a hairdresser and we were talking about Mike's head lice episode---she and I had laughed about it after it had happened--- and she said that Tea Tree shampoo by Matrix (available at beauty salons) will keep them away, once you have gotten rid of them.  Tea Tree doesn't work to get rid of them, but tends to keep them away, so maybe that will help you. Good luck!)

Bonnie:  yes, I've had a better day:  when I went to Sears this afternoon to purchase our washer and dryer and the salesperson brought up my name on the computer screen for my account because I had forgotten my card, there on the screen, right under my name, was MIKE JOHNSTON, with the address of the house we just moved from.  I just filled up and when she looked at me, I briefly explained, and she was very nice about it.  Put her hand on my shoulder and said she was so sorry...she couldn't have been more than early 20's, but so very nice about it.  So, it was a "bump" but I let my heart see it as more of a "hello, mom," and just let myself feel hugged. 

Thank you so much, all of you, for your good wishes and instructions to rest---I intend to do just that tomorrow.  I got the kitchen completely unpacked and set up this weekend, and hubby goes back to work and I am just going to veg all day tomorrow, maybe do some reading. 

Kay, I am so glad about your vacation with your husband...we are planning on doing some driving next summer, maybe visit some ball parks, etc., as hubby will be retired!  

Sherry:  I can empathize with your "lump" very well....and the loss of your friend...I think it has happened to all of us, sadly.

love and peace to all,     carol  mikesmomrs