Members BBB Posted February 15, 2021 Members Report Share Posted February 15, 2021 I often have people tell me that "Your wife would want you to be happy". Obviously. If I got to ask my wife if she would want me to be miserable or happy today, she of course would want me to be happy. That's logical. However, my issue is that I derived my happiness through her. SHE is what made me happy. Maybe that's weird because people don't seem to understand that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators KayC Posted February 15, 2021 Moderators Report Share Posted February 15, 2021 The conclusion I've come to is that yes, George would want me to be happy, but he would also understand how hard this is and would just care and want to put his arms around me. So imagine that, because I think that'd be more their reaction instead of a dismissive remark like that. George was the one who always understood me and anything I felt or was going through, I don't think that's changed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Sparky1 Posted February 15, 2021 Members Report Share Posted February 15, 2021 Thankfully no one has told me that. Yet. I'm sure my wife doesn't like me being a devastated, empty, lonely, broken hearted human being. Of course she wants me to be happy, but like you said BBB, I would be very happy holding my wife, kissing her but unfortunately I don't have that and that's what people don't understand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Bennie Jets Posted February 15, 2021 Members Report Share Posted February 15, 2021 Maybe it's best to look at people who care, and are brave enough to say something to one of us, as the parent character in the U.S. Peanuts series: when they talk in any of the episodes you can't hear what they say and the sound is just a muffled "woh wah wahh". Then we can thank them for being there and saying something, they thought may be helpful, without having to be hurt even more. Grief is just unlike anything in our culture: you can't do anything about it (hence the guilt and anger we sometimes feel, I think) and you can't fix it (which people usually want to do, as relfected in so many hurtful comments that imply that you could be well again anyway and that right soon). I can't do it either though, without giving myself a half-halt first. When my very kind and compassionate neighbor brought me a lasagna and other wonderful foods on the second day, I babbled about having been with Alan since the beginning of my time away from home and how I was scared to be alone, to feel less alone by sharing my fear, I guess. She said: 'oh, then it'll be good for you to be alone for a bit and learn it.' or something like that. I did shut up after that. I think she meant well, but telling a drowing person that this is good for them because they really should learn how to swim in life was not appropriate. People don't think before they speak. I am sure she just meant to help. I ate that lasagna for three days and would not have eaten anything else if she had not brought it, since I could not bring myself to eat things in our fridge that we had always eaten together before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Diane R. E. Posted February 15, 2021 Members Report Share Posted February 15, 2021 Oh my goodness, Bennie Jets; what an insensitive remark your neighbor made. I'm sorry you had to hear that! Yes, people do mean well when they mark such comments, but it doesn't excuse them. As for the saying "they would want you to be happy"; what do they mean by that anyway? Maybe we should ask them exactly what they mean. We can't just flip a switch and suddenly be happy without our partner. I'm suspecting when people make that comment they are thinking we need to find a new partner in order to be happy. In reality, we just want to be with the partner we lost. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Bennie Jets Posted February 15, 2021 Members Report Share Posted February 15, 2021 About the 'they would want you to be happy' comment: yes, I even found a you tube clip of the Dalai Lama saying that. I am not going to include a link here because I did *not* like it either, not even from him (I am usually curious if I can learn something from wise people in the world and usually open to listening). Also, and this is kind of personal, but I will post it in case it may help someone. Alan and I made a video six months before he died about this topic. So, I asked him 'If I am here by myself, em, you know, what would you want me to do?' and he *did* say exactly that: 'Just try to be as happy as possible?' It was a hard video to make because on many levels we were totally in denial and I am still fine with that. Never wanted either one of us to give up on him. And we didn't. In the video, though, it was about 30 minutes, we talked about a lot of things - some trivial, some serious - and he pointed me to activities I may enjoy, like my house plants, for example. He got me a T-shirt recently that says "Easily Distracted by Plants" because they did give me some joy even when he was very sick and I had to work and take care of him and we laughed about the plants being good for me. We even talked about him waiting for me 'on the other side' and some of this is too personal to post but one thing I wanted to mention - again, in case it helps someone - is that he brought up the movie "Unlikely Angel" with Dolly Parton in the lead role when we talked about me possibly being alone for so many years here. It is a Christmas movie we liked a lot, and it is worth seeing. In this movie the father lost his wife and is blind to a possible new love, not wanting to engage since he is mourning his wife. The family suffers and Dolly Parton enters as an angel with the task of fixing the situation. Dolly Parton is *not* the new love, she is just a helping angel with an attitude. The movie is mostly a comedy but I think it is done well and not offensive. The little boy, who is the son of the father, does not share in the happiness of the new love entering the family life. He runs away because he does not want his mom betrayed by the new relationship. They go to find him and explain to him that there is enough love for everyone. It's just a movie. But yes, Alan wanted me to be happy and also understood that that may be hard to do, while being very upset at being so ill. It was a tough time. I was afraid of watching that video but when I did, I found that I felt physically better. I think my brain gets comfort from hearing his voice. All this is so new and strange. I am saving all the voicemails and texts I can find. I think it helps. I'll go water some plants that need water. I am not happy, though. Just grateful we had the time together, me with such a fantastic angel, and hanging in there for now. [Yeah (a few hours later) everything has lost its joy - the plants used to occupy me and I was excited about new growth - now everything just reminds me of Alan. Nobody asks me anymore about my plants when I come back into the bedroom. He is not here. It hurts so much.] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Roxeanne Posted February 15, 2021 Members Report Share Posted February 15, 2021 Bennie i saw that clip of Dalai lama..since my early days of grief it helped me at least to understand that i was not alone in my pain. What a treasure your video with your husband talking about some difficult arguments! One of my close friend in the early times i lost my partner said to me: " you don't have to think about what it was.." People have no idea! She is clever and sensitive...but people have no idea ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members foreverhis Posted February 15, 2021 Members Report Share Posted February 15, 2021 Only a few people, none of them close friends or family, have said that kind of thing to me. Everyone else in my life is smart and sensitive enough to know two things: Of course, he would want me to be happy and of course, he'd know that wouldn't be possible in the same way. We always wanted the other to be happy, that's one of the things about true love and connection. Our happiness is tied to theirs in so many ways. I equate "He'd want you to be happy," with "At least he's not in pain now." I mean, did they think I wanted him to be in pain and suffering? Do they think I am so selfish as to want him to live longer for me if it meant that his life was torturous? I've come to the conclusion that just because someone says something just trying to be comforting or to connect with us, it doesn't mean we have to simply smile and think, "They meant well." Not that I'm saying we should react harshly or in anger all the time, but our society is so clueless about death, loss, and grief that if we don't gently try to educate others, none of us will ever learn how to help others who are grieving. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Bennie Jets Posted February 15, 2021 Members Report Share Posted February 15, 2021 27 minutes ago, foreverhis said: I've come to the conclusion that just because someone says something just trying to be comforting or to connect with us, it doesn't mean we have to simply smile and think, "They meant well." Not that I'm saying we should react harshly or in anger all the time, but our society is so clueless about death, loss, and grief that if we don't gently try to educate others, none of us will ever learn how to help others who are grieving. You are very strong and generous. And you are right, of course, but I just did not feel up to it. Like someone juggling 5 burning torches for the first time, I just did not feel like I could reach out and catch someone's knife and handle it in the mix. I just let it drop. But you are right, someone ought to *gently* point out some things - there is a page on the hospice web site for "What to say to a grieving person" - but my neighbor would not have had the chance to see it. Maybe I would write an editorial to the local newspaper about it one day. It would be much easier to talk to people that way, rather than after they said something hurtful they did not mean, I think. In that vein, for people in the United States, I did like that video from Beau about what to say or not say to a vet on Memorial Day... (53) Let's talk about the dos and don'ts of Memorial Day.... - YouTube Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members CSN51 Posted February 15, 2021 Members Report Share Posted February 15, 2021 1 hour ago, Roxeanne said: Bennie i saw that clip of Dalai lama..since my early days of grief it helped me at least to understand that i was not alone in my pain. What a treasure your video with your husband talking about some difficult arguments! One of my close friend in the early times i lost my partner said to me: " you don't have to think about what it was.." People have no idea! She is clever and sensitive...but people have no idea ! You are so right, Roxanne. I don’t think it’s possible to completely understand what it is like until you’ve had such a loss. I didn’t have a good understanding of it myself until I knew that I would be losing my husband. The people who have helped me the most are the ones who have also lost their spouse. They have been there and know what you are going through. Those people are the ones who let you know that you aren’t completely alone in your grief, and who give you hope that you will be able to survive the pain of that terrible loss Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members MissyLaLaLa Posted February 16, 2021 Members Report Share Posted February 16, 2021 I feel like alot of people try to comfort people who are grieving, but don't really know how. For example I had people tell me "It's okay you will find someone else or you will find love again". That's not something you say to someone who lost their husband. For me it just made me mad and want to cuss that person out. Saying he's in a better place doesn't help for me either. Some people it might help if the person lived in pain, but my husband died young. (39 years old) So to say he's in a better place than with me doesn't help me. I understand the meaning behind it though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members foreverhis Posted February 16, 2021 Members Report Share Posted February 16, 2021 12 hours ago, Bennie Jets said: You are very strong and generous. And you are right, of course, but I just did not feel up to it. Like someone juggling 5 burning torches for the first time, I just did not feel like I could reach out and catch someone's knife and handle it in the mix. I just let it drop. It's true that I am stronger now than I was 2-1/2 years ago. That's probably also why I have started to be able to gently explain to some people why saying certain things is painful and often hurts more than it helps. There is no way, simply no way, I could have done that in the first year or more. Not that I think I was weak exactly because every day I got out of bed, got dressed, and tried to do one "useful" thing. Doing that was a triumph during those months. But without my literal better half, my support, love, comfort, and best friend, I felt as if I had nothing to hold me up. There will always be that hole in my life and I'm sure that my heart will never fully mend. Although time doesn't heal everything, it is very slowly helping me rebuild some of the strength I had with John by my side. And that is what has helped me speak up sometimes. You are just at the very beginning of your loss and grief. Of course all you can do right now is breathe in and out. No one should expect otherwise and I apologize if I made you feel that you should. Right now your only "job" is to survive each day, one to the next. Your analogy is quite apt, I think. You have more than enough to handle as it is without worrying about what anyone else says or does. I am glad you found your way here. I can't tell you how much it has helped me to have the support and understanding of others who "get it" in ways no one else can. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators KayC Posted February 16, 2021 Moderators Report Share Posted February 16, 2021 22 hours ago, Bennie Jets said: there is a page on the hospice web site for "What to say to a grieving person" - but my neighbor would not have had the chance to see it. But we can print out something and give it to them later. It doesn't help the current moment but maybe they'll think before they speak next time to someone facing loss? https://www.griefhealingblog.com/2018/01/what-to-say-or-not-to-person-in-grief.html https://themighty.com/2016/12/what-to-say-to-someone-whos-grieving/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Bennie Jets Posted February 16, 2021 Members Report Share Posted February 16, 2021 10 hours ago, foreverhis said: It's true that I am stronger now than I was 2-1/2 years ago. That's probably also why I have started to be able to gently explain to some people why saying certain things is painful and often hurts more than it helps. There is no way, simply no way, I could have done that in the first year or more. Not that I think I was weak exactly because every day I got out of bed, got dressed, and tried to do one "useful" thing. Doing that was a triumph during those months. But without my literal better half, my support, love, comfort, and best friend, I felt as if I had nothing to hold me up. There will always be that hole in my life and I'm sure that my heart will never fully mend. Although time doesn't heal everything, it is very slowly helping me rebuild some of the strength I had with John by my side. And that is what has helped me speak up sometimes. You are just at the very beginning of your loss and grief. Of course all you can do right now is breathe in and out. No one should expect otherwise and I apologize if I made you feel that you should. Right now your only "job" is to survive each day, one to the next. Your analogy is quite apt, I think. You have more than enough to handle as it is without worrying about what anyone else says or does. I am glad you found your way here. I can't tell you how much it has helped me to have the support and understanding of others who "get it" in ways no one else can. Wow - I am in absolute agreement with you again! This site, and may I say *you* in it, are such a tremendous help, comfort, way for me to breathe at the moment. I don't know how I would do it without you! Thank you so much for taking the time out of your busy day to respond! It means the world to me now. "tried to do one 'useful' thing" - yes, exactly, that is my goal at the moment, too. I even gotten to the point where I realized I am so raw, I need to gently ask myslef to consider doing X the next day, and only if it suits. Then I usually do it and it is no problem. But I cannot ask myself to do things like I used to, like a slave driver. I used to do a lot more than I felt comfortable in a day. That is not in the picture now. I tread softly. No appology needed - If anything *I* wanted to push myself to say something, but had to write 'out loud' that I have my reasons not to. It was more a conversation with myself. Yes, I am so glad, too, that I found my way here. A friend of mine sent me a set of links and this site was the first one. They were all supposed to be reputable. I did not explore the others (yet), and am so grateful for this one right now! I was just about to start a new topic talking about that. Maybe I still will. This site, and writing things on paper, and you tube videos on grief and handling guilt and pain have been my life boat so far. Thank you @foreverhis for being there! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members luckystarhongkong Posted April 24, 2021 Members Report Share Posted April 24, 2021 On 2/16/2021 at 12:55 AM, Bennie Jets said: 'll go water some plants that need water. I am not happy, though. Just grateful we had the time together, me with such a fantastic angel, and hanging in there for now. [Yeah (a few hours later) everything has lost its joy - the plants used to occupy me and I was excited about new growth - now everything just reminds me of Alan. Nobody asks me anymore about my plants when I come back into the bedroom. He is not here. It hurts so much.] yeah that's exactly how I feel: me and my wife have a little balcony garden; we like potted plants; a few days before my wife passed we went to the flower market and bought some morning glory and fuchsia(some of them are still there). We used to be excited to see them grow and blossom. I could spend hours arranging these potted plants in various way to make it look perfect; now I have no joy in them anymore; I water them every morning for 1 min and that's it. On Sundays I used to wake up early and go jogging for an hour or so. When I got home, it's just the time she wakes up; we'll prepare simple breakfast and spend hours chattering in our balcony garden. She loved that garden with a panorama view of the green part of our city. Every day I went to work she'd wave goodbye to me on the balcony when I walk down the road in front of our mansion. The month before she passed she said to me,' everyday when I see you walking down the road to work you look so lonely; I don't want you to be lonely.' She had a severe sepsis 2 months earlier and was treated in ITU. That was dangerous. But miraculously after some really hard time she recovered and return home on X'mas day 2020. Even though she was improving well, she tended to talk more about life and death. She told me she should have gone in the ITU; but she missed me and our 14 yo daughter so she struggled to come back. I would tried to comfort her by saying that you'd be OK and we will be together until we got old. Just when we were thinking we will be fine suddenly she had an unrelated acute illness and passed. Eventually, I am all by myself. The problem in modern society is that people don't know how to face death; I don't blame anyone: I used to be one of them; I used to think that people who lose their love ones should be OK after some time and should 'get going' and I found it awkward to be in the company of widow/widower. Mainstream culture makes people feel they have control over their lives/the lives of their love ones but in fact, as everyone on this forum knows, we have little control when it comes to life and death. I was thinking if I am fortunate enough to be able to go through this grief, I should start a forum like this one in my own city(I'm in Hong Kong) in Cantonese so other people losing their love ones would get some support. That's what my wife wanted to do right before she left: to help others. Thank you everyone on this forum. Your kind words mean a lot to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators widower2 Posted April 24, 2021 Moderators Report Share Posted April 24, 2021 On 2/15/2021 at 9:38 AM, BBB said: I often have people tell me that "Your wife would want you to be happy". It would have taken a lot of will power for me to stop from saying something like "wow really, Capt Obvious? Thanks for that brilliant insight; and here all the time I was thinking she'd want me to be miserable. Thank God you came along!" Good grief. People... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators KayC Posted April 24, 2021 Moderators Report Share Posted April 24, 2021 9 hours ago, widower2 said: It would have taken a lot of will power for me to stop from saying something like "wow really, Capt Obvious? Thanks for that brilliant insight; and here all the time I was thinking she'd want me to be miserable. Thank God you came along!" Good grief. People... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members foreverhis Posted April 24, 2021 Members Report Share Posted April 24, 2021 11 hours ago, widower2 said: It would have taken a lot of will power for me to stop from saying something like "wow really, Capt Obvious? Thanks for that brilliant insight; and here all the time I was thinking she'd want me to be miserable. Thank God you came along!" Good grief. People... Oh yes! "Thanks a lot, Captain Obvious" is one of my absolute favorite internal things to say. I've even said it about someone else to a select few of my "posse" who I trust 100%. They get why I am so irked and can help me move past it. But I think I mentioned that I haven't had too much of that anyway, so it doesn't happen often. I'm lucky in that way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators widower2 Posted April 25, 2021 Moderators Report Share Posted April 25, 2021 Honestly I haven't either. I guess that's lucky in a way...although the flip side is largely people haven't said ANYTHING to me, which IMO is worse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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