Loss of an Adult Child

[Crystal16]

Hello all,

Amy/Dee- I agree Florida’s has better weather then the two of you are having. I was raised and grew up in Maine and you never forget those cold winter evenings and wake to a cold morning. Dee- I’m glad what you thought had happened when you woke was indeed strange and not reality.

Rhonda- I can relate and sympathize with being so tired at the end of the day. As mothers we wear a mask and play a part that carries you to complete exhaustion.

Sherry/Kathy- Ladies you are talented I wish I had the patience a talent for quilting but I lack both. My sister Shannon has those gifts and she does beautiful work on the blankets she has made over the years for my children. Kathy- anxious to see the pictures of the quilt it sounds beautiful.

Susannah- Very peaceful dream I would like to wake to those warm thoughts. After reading Dee’s post for over three months I would have to agree with your impression of her.

Carol- I love the picture it is always nice to put a face with the people you've known to appreciate.

So I have a week left before my surgery. I am ready to get this procedure done and be on the road to recovery!

I pray that everyone feels the presence and warmth of God today, may our Angels aid and comfort us when we feel weary.

[ericasmom]

Carol, you are too sweet to say such a thing, that John (gnome) and I would be as Sus saw us in her dream. Sus, I might fold your laundry, but I don't fold well, just so you know, no two towels are folded like each other. I do however have that photo that you are speaking of on my gallery. It is a good photo of us, I don't usually photograph well anymore, that photo worked.

You are a dolly.

Love to you all, I am sneaking a look at our home here while in a meeting, Institute day with meetings and while there is some good stuff, I am overwhelmed by the amount of info, so came here to feel my breathing again, to feel all the love coming off the page.

Peace out.

dee

[westleysmom]

Dee-I was wondering if you were tied up somehow, I know how those days of training go. Its too much too fast, but they try to get it all in as short a time as possible. I always liked that song but didn't know who it was by. Thanks for the video and the words, I have a hard time catching the words to some of these songs, so that always helps. Hope the rest of the day goes by fast.

Susannah-If you dream of me and my husband that we're remodeling your bathroom or something, I promise not to tell him. He is the all-around handyman extraordinare and we are working on the last of the bathrooms at my house. I'm sure he gets tired of doing the same thing at home that he does all day at work, although at work, he's usually only working with wood, and not plumbing or tile. I wish you could see some of his work, he is really one of those people who can make something beautiful out of a piece of wood, like Sherry and Kathy can with fabric or Trudi with ink and paper. I can make two columns of numbers balance, that's my "great" talent. It sounds like you got Dee and John pegged though.

Amy-Loved the sweet picture of Autumn (think I got the name right, you're on page 2 now) in her finery. Marking time by events that happen every year is something that used to be comforting in a way, you know if its January, all the recipes in the magazines will be for Super Bowl parties. If its June, they're for July 4 celebrations. Now that time has stopped for our angels, it doesn't seem right that all the hoopla goes on, as if nothing has changed, when for us, nothing is the same at all. I'm there with you sister, being dragged sometimes kicking and screaming through the "Days of Our Lives" Hugs to you.

Crystal-Whenever I have something like your surgery coming up, I always just wish they would go ahead and do it already so I can quit dreading it! like pulling a band aid off quickly. Sounds like you're a girl after my own heart, so I hope this week doesn't drag for you and you are ready to get this thing over with.

Carol-We've warmed back up some here, I hope you get a little bit warmer weather soon. Have a good time playing with Damon in the snow.

Betty-I hope you are able to get on and read a little and that your sister is still doing well and so are you. Will be glad when you are back so we can see Stephen's smiling face.

Lorri-I hope you get to come back soon, too, I know what you mean about the phones. My husband got a new one at Christmas, and I can just now figure out how to answer it if he needs me to. Smart phones make me look silly, in other words, probably not really that hard to do.

We are getting some rain today, I wish it would wash all this nasty salt away, although I think our local highway dept is out, which could mean bad news if we get more bad stuff on the roads. Stay safe, all my friends

[Crystal16]

Rhonda- You are correct my personality is ripping the band aid off not slowly removing it.

When Ashlee died I was the statue of strength. My sisters and I handle all the funeral arrangements and I held my head high when people wanted to grieve. Now… all I want to do is bargain with God to bring my Ashlee back!

[westleysmom]

I know what you mean Crystal. I found BI about five months after, which is where you are now, and that time is when it seemed to me that the shock was truly wearing off, although I had thought it was already gone before. It seemed to get worse for a while, and then building up to the holidays and this month, the one year mark was really bad. Now that those "big" days are past, I'm hoping that it doesn't continue to get worse. I think everybody is different, but getting through that first angelversary was quite draining, and it seems that things are at least not getting worse, even if they're not getting better. Strength is demonstrated in many different ways, and sometimes breaking down is our only choice. And I don't guess I'll ever stop trying to bargain with God, crazy as it sounds. Peace to you, and strength for whatever the day brings.

[ericasmom]

Crystal, you are like us in that same way, we made all of the arrangements, we cared for others as they grieved our Child, and then we fall apart, but the falling apart is not a sign of weakness my dear, it is still the strength that was shown in those weeks that followed the most tragic event in your life, the strength to also grieve. It takes great stores of energy to grieve, we don't have great stores after being shocked from our old lives into the new raw world we all find ourselves in that first year or so, so we need to allow the tears, the bargaining, the fantasizing and the just plain horribly sad parts to come to the surface so that one day, maybe not for a while yet, you will feel the strength that others must see in you, that we read and feel in you. I dare say that at our weakest, we are stronger than most humans ever will be. I so hope that the surgery goes well, that recovery is not so bad, and that the many events in your life allow you to breathe and know that you are loved from above and from right here.

Rhonda, yep, a general meeting this morning where the union leader tried once again to tell us why we should take a pay freeze...you know that just does not go over well with me, anyow then on to a new reading curric,. in service. And while the presenter was good, the materials are interesting though not earth moving, it all was too much too fast for my pea-sized brain to take it all in. Now I am back at the quiet school making sure of my presentation this coming Friday and Saturday. I feel much better now, somewhat prepared.

love to all,

[Guest msnher]

Carol - Thank you for posting the pictures. I've seen them before and is probably the basis of what little I had to go on in my dream. Dee looks like Mary Steenburgen.

I just got back and haven't read the rest of the posts yet. I just wanted to clarify that I had seen a couple of pictures of Dee before but it's been awhile. Just keeping myself honest. Now, I'm going to read the posts.

[Guest msnher]

Dee - I've always been quite anal about my laundry and the way it is folded and put away. Can you believe my home was once used as an example to show young mothers how to organize closets? Well those days are gone! This last Saturday Mariah asked if she could do laundry. I haven't allowed her to because I don't want her in the mother role, but she used to do laundry (growl - when she was only 6 and being abused) and it was something she actually enjoyed. Finally, I told her she could fold the basket of towels. She did - none of them like I would have - and put them away - none of them like I would have - and I loved it! She so happy about it. I let her watch me sort the clothes and let her put the load in the washer, showing her how to add the soap and set the dial. I swear to God that's all I've heard about. Even when I dropped her off at school her last words were, "I hope there are clothes to wash when I get home." I left the load of towels in the washer so she can put them in the dryer when she gets home. I hope her teachers know I'm not trying to turn her into the mother. Anyway, my point is, it's okay if you fold my laundry your own way..all cattyrompus (sp?)...

Jasmine's teacher just called to find out if the local paper could interview Jasmine. A musical group from Ireland (I don't know which one) came to the school today and Jasmine was the only child out of the whole school who got to play the harp. Pretty cool. I just love that school and those teachers. I so wish we could pay them what we pay professional sports players.

Crystal - If it makes you feel better, your feelings are normal and your grief is exactly where it's supposed to be at this timeline. It sucks. No doubt about it. But, hang on to us, the people here are true lifesavers.

Nap time...Susannah/Stephanie's mom

[Guest msnher]

This was written on Stephanie's memorial today - "i was there the day she died. Im Kenny Smith's daughter. I am so sorry for your loss. She was an amazing woman. She meant everything to me when I met her. She made me smile, and made me feel like I was important! Thankyou "

I don't know who this person is. We found out after Stephanie died that she was dating a man named Kenny Smith referred to as "Satan's sperm" by one of her friends. It was his fourwheeler she was on. I can't follow up on this, but it's tipped me off center a bit. I thought his children were just little. Certainly too young to write this note.

Thanks for listening.

Susannah/Stephanie's mom

<BR clear=left>

[Crystal16]

I'm afraid of what's to come... I cried out loud tonight feeling guilty and empty I didn't protect my girl. I want to numb or medicate myself from feeling these flood of emotions. If I could only run to the ends of the earth screaming my baby's name begging God to take me and bring her back!!!! I sit here looking at her pictures and ask WHY, why did this have to happen. I let Ashlee down I didn't protect her is what plays in my head over and over....

[daveydow1]

Amy-----I so know what you mean about feeling sad when seeing Ashley's friends moving on with life.

It does cause a stab to the heart......knowing your child is not here anymore, and it is definitely a

painful experience to see others moving on. I'm sorry. Thanks for the pic of cute little Autumn. I have

never machine quilted, but am considering doing it for the border of my quilt.....not sure yet. I know

what you mean about not getting back to the quilt......mine layed around for a couple years, I think,

before I got back to it.

Kathy----Your butterfly quilt sounds beautiful. I had done two applique quilts in the past for my two

daughters. Both quilts were the Sunbonnet Sue pattern. I had saved many scraps of material from

making dresses for them, and used some of the scraps to design a few of the dresses on the

Sunbonnet Sue pattern. They got a charge out of seeing the material, and said they remembered

the dresses I had made for them when they were at the ages of 6 or 7. (they are quite a few years

apart in age). It's so nice that you have the butterfly quilt laying on your bed. Jessica must smile

down when she sees it. I, too, find it relaxing to do sewing/needlework/quilting. I no longer make

any clothing now......other than PJ's for the grandies now & then.

Colleen-----I didn't not know that grossbeaks were also the rose-breasted, and blue grosbeak kinds. I have

never seen one, I don't think. The naturalist said that he didn't think the birds were endangered, just that

they have not been seen in the greater Ohio Valley area for a few years,.....so that is good, if they are still

thriving in the northern states like yours. I'll have to look them up in one of the many bird books we have.

Carol----Oh,....Thanks so much for posting the pic of all you BI gals when you met. Such a nice pic outdoors.

I don't sew clothing anymore. Gave that up quite awhile ago, but used to do a lot more sewing in my 'younger days'.

Embrodery is my favorite. Love using all the many colors......like painting with a needle.

Crystal-----I will try to post a pic of my quilt... IF, and when I ever get it finished. Much work yet to do though. I wish

you peace on this journey, friend. May your memories of sweet Ashlee warm your heart & soul.

Dee-----Thanks for the nice song----bittersweet words. Oh the conference----getting boring & all. I agree that those

kinds of things give way too much information to absorb. I used to have to go to them when working in the library,

and they got so boring. There was an article in the paper today about "INFORMATION OVERLOAD"----it was quite

amusing. One particular speaker at one of the library staff day conferences said ( about 10 min. into his talk) that

an audience loses interest/concentration after about an hour. A funny co-worker sitting near me said, as a quiet

aside, to the guy next to him........." an HOUR, huh?" (meaning he was already bored.) It was so funny. The speaker

droned on & on, even went over the amount of time he was supposed to talk, and everyone was so bored......you could tell. .

Oh well,.....I guess we all have had to endure those times. I imagine that your conference was good, but the one

I spoke of was very boring and tedious......people griped about it for weeks afterward.

PEACE TO ALL INDIGOS.

Davey&Lisasmom, Sherry

[Guest msnher]

Crystal - Hang on. The numbness is wearing off and you are more raw now than you were in the moments after Ashlee's death. I had those exact same feelings. I tried to act as normal as I could but inside I was this crazy woman who just ran, screaming that gutteral pain that we all know intimately...waving my arms in the air. I thought I understood true insanity. You did not fail your sweet Ashlee, my dear friend. However, we each go through those feelings. They are such normal feelings on this horrendous path we now find ourselves on. My 18 yr old nephew shot and killed himself in 91. I couldn't deal with the intensity of the pain and medicated my pain with pills and booze. Years later I had to seek help to get sober. The booze/pills worked wonders in medicating the pain of my nephew's death and my life in general, but I totally destroyed myself and my family in the meantime. So, when I got sober I not only had the task of cleaning up the mess I had made with my drinking I was surprised to find I also had to deal with the pain of my nephew's death as if it had just happened. Not fun. That experience helped me know the only way I get to walk through Steph's death is to walk through it and feel every rotten, hedious emotion that rears it's ugly head. 100 of them all at once...or one right after the other. You are feeling all of it at once right now. It will get easier. But, not for a while. Hang on, Sweetie (as Dee would say). We're here for you. We've all been right where you are. You don't walk this nightmare alone.

Much love,

Susannah/Stephanie's mom

[aim630]

Crystal- You didn't let Ashlee down. Although we want to be able to protect our children from anything bad, there are just some things we have no control over. I feel the guilt myself, I think we all do, no matter how our children died, even though there is nothing we could have done. We know, and they know, we would have done anything in our power to save them, and trade places with them, so that they could live a full life. It's just not fair, and I'll never understand WHY, but I know you would have jumped in front of her to save her if you could have. Maybe someday we'll find out why. In the meantime, come here & talk to us, because we all understand. I knew right away I could not handle this without some help, and I found this website within the first 10 days. I tried going to a support group, and they were great, but I just feel more comfortable in my own house, plus I can log on day or night, and know there's been more posts to read, so I always feel connected. Sending prayers and hugs your way, and hoping Ashlee sends you some peace and comfort.

It was nice to see the picture of you all, after talking to you for several months.

Dee-You are welcome to come fold my laundry. I'm not picky at all. I should warn you, there are several baskets that need done. I have no problem washing & drying the laundry, I just hate putting it away. Probably because my closet is so full of clothes that don't fit anymore (15 lbs later), that there is no room to squeeze in anything else.

Susannah-It is sweet that Mariah is being so helpful with the laundry. I know she is young, and you don't want her to feel she HAS to do it, especially after all that she's been through, but it's nice that she wants to do it. My 17 yr old just started doing her own laundry after many arguments and complaints that a certain shirt was not clean. I told her if she did her own laundry, then she could make sure what she wanted to wear was clean. Ashley started doing her own laundry at about 15. Of course she threw everything in the same load together (towels, black pants, red shirts). She also had a habit of pulling our dry laundry out of the dryer, and just kind of throwing it somewhere (not in a laundry basket) so she could dry her own load of laundry. One of my pet peeves, but boy would I welcome it now. I wouldn't care WHERE she threw my clean laundry, as long as she was here to throw it somewhere! I'm sorry the note on Stephanie's memorial site shook you up. Is it possible Kenny's daughter is a young teenager? She could have been 11 or 12 at the time. Ashley was 12 when I was 30.

Well I just probably go put some of my laundry away...

Amy/Ashley's mom

[zachysmom]

Just wanted to let you all know Elisha is home again and doing as well as can be. They changed her meds and we hope it works. Thanks for all the good thoughts and prayers for my family. We found out my husbands dad has from 6 to 9 months. I have started to talk to Elisha about it and just taking it slow. Right now she knows he is very sick but that is it, I am taking it slow with her to give her time to absorb and understand what is happening and going to happen.

Beth

[Guest msnher]

You are such a good mother, Beth.

Much love,

Susannah/Stephanie's mom

[ericasmom]

Beth, the steps you take are so very hard and yet, you take them. Our prayers will continue of course, as you find ways to help your Daughter and your Husband, and Yourself through the myriad of emotions. Remember to please take good care of you. If we were there we would be checking to make sure that you are drinking plenty of water and eating something at each meal time. Peace one day.

Sus, you would be appalled by my folding. To think that you were the example for those new Moms. You are an organized human, and I am not. I am the least organized teacher I know. But somehow, it all gets done, just not neatly. Thanks for that spectacular compliment, Mary Steenburgen. She is a much thinner woman, but I will take that and run with it. I think it is sweet that Mariah loves to do the laundry. She could be identifying with you, she could also be mothering, she could have inherited her Grannies tendancies toward organization, and she could simply love the way it smells and feels to do the laundry. It is a great job for her, and one thta she obviously enjoys taking on, at least for now. Both of my children had to do their own laundry by the age of 12 if they wanted clean clothes.

Sherry, yes, the inservice today got to be a bit much, but it was a lot better than many. The woman presented well, and it is interesting to see all the ways to incorporate the new curric.

I hope that I can hold the attention of other teachers when I present this week at McCormick Place at a conference on Early Childhood. We'll see if anyone signs up for my workshop. There are over 300 presenters so it may be that nobody does. I am not getting paid for this, though the hoops to jump through to be accepted as a presenter sure were stringent, so I guess it is an honor, however, no pay and they dont' offer free parking? I am about to get angry at 19.00 a crack. I am presenting two different days and cannot take public trans due to the amount of materials I will have with me. I just thought that presenters would be free...silly me.

tomorrow a field trip to the Art Institute of Chicago.

Crystal, the guilt, we all have had it, we deal with it as we must, but many of us take it in like a second skin. Try not to Sweetie, try to shed it instead, as it gets you nowhere on this path, just stuck. I know moving forward doesn't look much better than standing still, but I really do promise that it will get better. Guilt just allows you to continue to feel as low as possible. You have surgery coming up, you need to boost your immune system if you can, not deplete it. So listen, think of the advice you would give any one of us or a new parent to this site if they were talking about the ways that they feel guilty. Now really listen to what you would say, and take that advice. We don't know why we could not make it different for our Children, but one day we will know. Until then, let go as much as you can to the guilt.

Amy, you are not fussy about your laundry, then I will help you with it. WE could see whose stack of towels looks more lopsided. (mine)

[mikesmum]

Kathy - Love the pic, glad you are finding peace with your quilting. Something I have no patiences for.

Dee - Chasing Cars, one of the songs that played that week Mike died. The day he died "How to save a life" played everywhere Steven was. The words summed up how he and Mike were finding each other after a number of years of being at odds.

The music, the lyrics underscoring thoughts and feelings that we find hard to put into words.

Called into a 'local produce' market. Bought 'organic' fruit. Usually don't bother at the supermarket but this stuff looked brilliant. An apricot that took me straight back to my nanna's garden when we picked and ate from tree....ummmmmmmm.

Hills this weekend ~ Mal's eldest is moving into his own home....big steps.

Love to you all....Trudi & MD.

[mikesmum]

From Steven for Micheal....if only we'd know how to save a life....

[ericasmom]

Trudi Dear, another wonderfully poignant song, singing out the lives of those we love so dearly. Maybe why Jonathan hardly listens to music, don't know. Sweet Stephen, Brother was letting you know.

Very little sleep again, so broken up with insomnia. Sleep walker today.

[Bensmummy]

Just dropping in to say hello to you all.. Dee the dread locks at the market on Sunday were a huge hit....I looked over at my stand and I thought I saw a little Eri perched on top...smiles :-)

Bens girl friend is having trouble thinking of what to put on Bens head stone and said could I suggest a few things..oh now I get asked to be involved with anything to do with Ben..anyway so I thought maybe IDIOT! would be appropriate. I have anger flashes over his accident then get all mushy and want him back right now....cause I so want to smack him around the ear hole...for going so fast.

I wrote this one ....To dream is to go to the edge...To live the dream is to go over the edge.... Bens brother loves it and seems Ben girlfriend does too... You see Ben always said you cant just Dream and Dream and not actually act them out you have to go and do the Dream live ..even if it takes you over the edge and you end up dying ...obviously he dreamt he wanted to go over 200 kilometers an hour on his bike and he lived the dream..momentarily but he didnt get to tell the tale did he?

It is very recognizably him. Is this appropriate to put on a headstone though????

any thoughts on this...another reason I prefer cremation...dont have to have a headstone...priciest piece of granite too..$5000 worth ....Ben has had more money spent on him since he has died than when he was alive in the one spending session if you get my drift...that does my head in a bit too.

big sigh from Michelle

Ps I found out that Ben had a secret girlfriend when he was younger. A friend of mine had a daughter and those two were sweet on each other..he gave her little presents...probably some of my stuff and only two weeks before Ben died, after many years and a marriage to someone else she got rid of them. Now she is really sad...and her mum and I couldnt stop laughing at the fact we never knew...lol secretive little kids they were. LoL A few girls came up to me around town with big teary eyes ..unable to speak just so upset..he was a bit of heart breaker it seems ...love the girls for trying to express there sadness to me though it was I comforting them poor darlings.

[Crystal16]

So I come into work this morning and start blubbering like a fool. I had two pictures mailed to me last night of the kids, Ashlee’s big smile lights up a room.

Beth- Glad to hear Elisha is home. As we can all attest to death is hard to arrange for no matter what age.

Dee- Enjoy your field trip to the Art Institute of Chicago.

Michelle- I can relate to your emotions I’m feeling this morning. I want to ask Ashlee WHY you allowed Dylan to point the gun at you, I would have expected you to scream IDIOT, hit him until he dropped it… NOT pull the shot gun upwards towards your head!!!! I too am angry.

I like the quote you would consider putting on Ben’s headstone, I feel it’s appropriate. It is who he is and was…

I try not to feel guilty but the guilt at least makes me feel something… I agree, Dee, I would be the first to tell a parent who is on this journey to be kind to themselves. It’s a slow process we need to press into.

[westleysmom]

Beth-I'm not sure I know how old Elisha is, but I'm glad she is doing better. We had to go to the funeral home last night because an older lady in our church died. She was a neighbor of my daughter's in-laws, and they (my daughter and her husband and my granddaughter) came to the funeral home too. My granddaughter is going through that stage (she'll be 3 in May) where they act shy around strangers, and cling to you. After we left, these were her questions to her Mommy and Daddy on the way home:

-What happened to make her die?-Why were those people sad?-Why wasn’t she sad?

-Where did she go when she died?-Did she go in the trashcan?-Did she go in the water?

I think we might not should have taken her. When Westley died last year, she was eighteen months old, and of course at the time, Westley was one of her everyday people, as he lived at Nana and Papa's house. She knew when she heard loud music on the radio of a car coming down the road that it was probably Westley and she would say "Westley's coming!" We were all there, and we had no one to leave her with. So at the funeral home, we were careful (or tried to be, you know how crazy you are at the time) not to pick her up where she could see him in the casket. I think we all were afraid she would start talking to him and tell him to get up or ask why he wasn't awake, which of course, was the question on our minds too. The questions she had last night break my heart, and of course my daughter had to try to explain to her that Mrs. Ann was old and had been sick. But then lots of people in her life are old, and she was afraid that might make her be scared that other old people would die. Which we know is true, but don't want to talk about to her, hell, we don't want to talk about it to ourselves. I told my daughter that we should probably try to arrange for the little one not to go to visitations or funerals for a while, unless we can't possibly work it out. So I was just wondering if anybody had any advice for dealing with little ones and death discussions. She's very smart, and that makes it harder to choose words carefully enough not to scare or confuse her.

Michelle-I know what you mean about the amount of money we've spent since they died. When we bought the plot, we both just cried because we had been hoping to help him get started in an apartment or maybe a fixer-upper. I would have paid all the money I have or will ever have not to be buying a 4x6 (or whatever size it is) piece of ground, to instead be buying a ratty old house for him to work on and for us to help him get started in his adult life. And the headstone? The most beautiful piece of chiseled granite that I will ever purchase and hate with all my heart. I have said that if I could gnaw it to the ground with my teeth, I'd get started now if it would bring him back and make the reason for its being untrue. His just has his name and the dates on the front, and on the back, our last name, Beloved Son and Brother, Always in our Hearts. But I think your idea sounds like it fits Ben and that he would love it. I guess Westley would have liked us to do something "edgy" but we just went with kind of sappy, because that's how we were feeling. Heartbreaker for sure, it sounds like Ben was.

Crystal-Crying at work, I do that nearly every day. I try to keep people from actually witnessing, but I'm sure they see the signs. Unless they're completely heartless (and those people do exist), nobody is usually surprised if they know the circumstances. I know how those pictures bring you pain, but still they light up the room. When I go to the cemetery, I usually just say "I'm sorry" over and over again while I cry. I know how crazy I sound, but I can't seem to stop myself.

[Guest msnher]

Good morning, Indigo's;

Dee - The woman who was so organized and clean doesn't live here anymore. She's been gone for a long, long time. I figure towels folded haphazard (is that a word?) and stuffed in the linen closet are better than where I keep them now....in a pile on the floor in my bedroom. Sometimes they stay in a basket, unless the baskets are full of other loads. Closets are now where we hurriedly (is that a word?) throw stuff when company's coming. Truth be told, I liked my house better when the organized woman lived here, but my family seems happier with her gone.

Michelle - To dream is to go to the edge...To live the dream is to go over the edge I think is perfect for Ben's headstone. Thank you for sharing it here, today. I needed to hear it myself. I don't only think it's perfect, I think it's a beautiful representation of your son. Beautiful words, indeed. What a sweet thing for his little girl friend to share with you.

Crystal - I don't think Dylon has told the whole story about what happened that day. I don't think she "allowed" him to point the gun at her, but once he did I think she was going to show him who was really in control and showed her bravery by pointing the barrel of the gun at her head. I don't think she realized she would really die. I don't think she realized dead is permanent. It's the immortality of youth. It became a power struggle. Were they fighting/arguing? Did she have a tendency to be physical when she was angry? Maybe she was trying to leave him. I don't know. I think she's still trying to protect Dylon. They loved each other, but they were volitale....she wants to save him from suffering the consequences of his actions. Wow. I keep getting this feeling that they had had those arguments many times before but he just got the gun and it just went too far and she was trying to show him she wasn't afraid and he couldn't scare her. I think the reason Dylon isn't being completely honest is because he's afraid of being in even worse trouble than he is. Ashlee just regrets the whole thing. She keeps saying it was all her fault, but it wasn't all her fault - he shouldn't have pointed the gun at her, but she's convinced it's her fault. She feels horrible because of the pain everyone is in. She keeps saying "look what I've done. I didn't mean for this to happen." Crystal - I am putting this out there, in public, so you can have the support of everyone here and you can tell me to go to hell and/or you can rebuke the message. I'm so sorry, my friend. So sorry. She hugs you and wipes your tears all the time.

[Crystal16]

Susannah- I’m not sure if they were fighting that day. I have seen them argue in the past but nothing physical. Otherwise, I would have kicked his --- and made sure he never spoke to or came around Ashlee again! Physical, I guess Ashlee could be that way she was tough nothing scared her. Ashlee always stuck up for the people that were being bullied. She even got off her bike one afternoon when she rode by a group of three boys that were picking on a younger/smaller boy. She stopped in front of the group and yelled stop and said come pick on someone your own size and started walking towards them and the three boys ran leaving the little one for her to say its okay let me bring you home. I don’t disagree with the volatile relationship even thou her father and I never saw that. I grew up in a very volatile home and I brought it into my marriage and that is one of the many reasons we divorced. Please explain why you think Ashlee blames herself, can you hear her saying this or dreamt it? I pray justice is done when it comes to Dylan being sentenced. I will never hold my Angel on this side of Heaven again and I am angry Dylan’s grossly negligent act took her from me.

[Guest msnher]

Crystal - It is just a feeling which I can't explain. And, it might be total b.s. I did not see Ashlee. I did not hear Ashlee...not in the conventional sense. This morning has been pretty much like every other morning. After dropping the kids off at school I came back home, got a hot cup of coffee and got in bed and logged onto BI. I read the posts I had missed..and, when I read yours, I "felt" deep regret and the words "It's all my fault". I can't tell you how one "feels" words, but that's the only way I know how to describe it.

[mikesmomrs]

Crystal wrote: "I do that nearly every day. I try to keep people from actually witnessing, but I'm sure they see the signs. Unless they're completely heartless (and those people do exist), nobody is usually surprised if they know the circumstances. I know how those pictures bring you pain, but still they light up the room. When I go to the cemetery, I usually just say "I'm sorry" over and over again while I cry. I know how crazy I sound, but I can't seem to stop myself.”

Crying…you are so new to this, how could you not be crying every day? For the first year after Mike died, I spent every day, EVERY day, crying, all the way to work and all the way home… Sometimes, while crying, I would be also screaming “I’m sorry, I’m so sorry!” People were constantly asking me if I had a bad cold…my voice was raspy and it hurt to talk sometimes….the only one who really understood (outside my family) was Mike’s middle son’s other grandmother (they all loved Mike very much)…she asked me one day if I had a bad cold, and when I told her no, she instantly understood and just quietly took my hand). It really hurt to cry, but I figured I “deserved” the pain, so didn’t worry about it. The stopping of that behavior was VERY gradual...going into work with a red face and red swollen eyes became the norm…of course, people weren’t going to say anything anyway, so it didn’t matter if I went into work with red swollen eyes---I really didn’t care…and I couldn’t have stopped myself no matter what. I also used to just say “I’m sorry” over and over again at the cemetery…there didn’t seem to be any other words that existed for me at that point in time. As Sus and others have said, you are exactly where you are expected to be (at least by US) on this journey, and you are so new to this, that nothing else could be expected.

Beth: I am glad also that Elisha is home and doing well. And I too think you are a good mom…you seem to be handling things with her in the best way possible. I applaud you.

Sus: I am so glad that your grandies have such good teachers and a good school...they truly deserve all good that comes their way…and their very biggest blessings are you and Gary.

Michelle: I agree with what others have said regarding what you are proposing to be put on Ben’s stone…it is tough sometimes to be able to state it out loud, but whatever/whoever our children were, they still are…and always will be, in our hearts…that is how we remember them. Mike had an adventurous spirit, also, but toned it down (a little) over time because of his kids. Then cancer got him. So, I wondered sometimes if he felt he had denied himself some of the adventure he would have pursued had he known…another of those questions that will likely never be answered, and that eventually we come to realize that the answer doesn’t matter. Mike took a trip to CA at one point to “find himself” and what he wanted to do with his life. On the way there, he came into Utah during the middle of the night, coming over the crest of a hill, and suddenly faced with the huge city laid out before him, lit up in the distance, but he was still surrounded by pitch darkness and the brilliance of the stars in the sky above. He commented on it in his diary (he was not driving) at the time, and after noting its beauty and the awesome sight of it all, wrote “The vastness of the sky only serves to remind me how earthbound we truly are.” On his memorial stone we put “….earthbound no more.” Mike was cremated, but after he had been gone a while, we realized that we wanted something permanent, somewhere, so we had the stone done, and sprinkled some of his ashes beneath it. Mike’s wife did not want any input on what went on the stone…it is something we’ve not been able to discuss other than for her to say at the time that she didn’t want to. The stone has his name, then “loving son, brother, uncle, husband, and daddy” We have the family name on a bench beside Mike's stone...it is now our "family plot." I never would have dreamed one of my children would occupy it before we did, but then, none of us here did... (the stone is actually all black, with white lettering)

this was the day we all visited for the first time...Damon put the flower petals over Mike's picture, and all the branches are from trees that Mike had helped us plant when we built our house. (The picture is of Mike, in Costa Rica, on a high school trip)

Rhonda: I know what you mean about having the small children at a funeral…Damon was not quite 2 when Mike died…Sarah did not have him at the wake, but brought him to the memorial service. (Mike’s body was not at the memorial service.) At the wake, Sarah was very careful not to have Damon in the room with the casket…others took turns caring for him in another room, and when he was finally brought into the meeting room for the prayer service, she sat in the back, with him in her lap, so no one would lift him up to the casket, which was open. Immediately after the prayer service, her brother took him home. It is a difficult thing to know what to say, what they will understand, etc. Sarah has done an excellent job with Damon in that regard and he has only come into some understanding of things in this past year or so. She has kept his daddy’s memory alive, and acquainted Damon with who his daddy was and what he was like, but has let Damon move ahead at his own pace. It kind of threw us when, a few weeks ago, on our way home with Damon after picking him up at school, he told us “I told Sam today that my daddy died and Sam said “will he grow back?” I asked him what he told Sam, and he said “Mrs. Ames (his teacher) stepped in and helped out with that.” Damon was very matter-of-fact about it all. I think one of the most heartbreaking instances involving him since Mike died was the second birthday celebration we had for Mike after he died. While Sarah was helping Damon get dressed to go, he said to her “I wonder if my daddy is somewhere getting dressed to come to his birthday today.” If only….

Trudi: Thank you for sharing the song…I am glad for your “return” to your nanna’s tree in her garden…memories like that keep us going. How are the floods now? Any closer? I hope not.

Dee: I don’t think that your “disorganization” interferes one bit with the wonderful education of life that you impart to your children who are blessed with your presence every day. I tend to go through stages of organization and stages of wishing I was organized. Much more messy than I used to be, but “order” just doesn’t seem so important anymore. Oh, I can well remember those “presentations” we would have to listen to sometimes for work…”TQM” (total quality management) used to drive me insane! There were many “instructional meetings’ that found me drifting off. I don’t think I would drift off during one of your presentations…I think I would thoroughly enjoy it. Enjoy the visit to the Art Institute.

We are scheduled for another snowstorm tomorrow night...don't know where it's all going to go! Take care everyone, and stay warm!

holding you all close and sending love and peace,

carol mikesmomrs

[daveydow1]

Susannah-----That is so nice that Mariah likes helping with the laundry. I think it's good for kids to get involved

in household chores......makes them feel like a real part of the family. Bless her little buttons.

Dee-----I hope the field trip was rewarding. Ahhh....the Art Institute of Chicago....a wonderful place to visit. Wow---

$19. to park at McCormich Place!! Good luck with the workshop. I looked up the grossbeaks in the birdbook. I

definitely would have remembered if I had ever seen one of them----they are so big, and colorful (males). As it

is----I don't believe I have ever seen one in my life. They are so grand .

Michelle-----You wrote a nice line for Ben's monument. As Carol said.......we loved them for who and what they

were........always in our hearts.

Beth-----Glad to hear Elisha is home, and on meds. Sending thoughts & prayers .

Rhonda-----Oh, friend......I so know what you mean about now not being able to help West. I feel that way so much

of the time about Dave. We wanted to help him buy some sort of house too. But.,......we were all 'working stiffs' and

had not much money between us. Couldn't help him with other things, but we tried in small ways. Now that we

could help him......alas......we can't . I feel like the only thing we did for him was buy him a tombstone with 'Our Son'

written on it. Here's how I feel------Westley (and Dave) (and all BI Angels).....are in a realm...very near to us, and that

they know that we would do anything for them.....even though we may not have been able to when they were with us

here. I think they are blessed with a sense that they 'understand'. This is my hope, anyhow. Peace to you, Rhonda.

Crystal----As you say.......Dylan may not be forthcoming with everything because he fears he may be in deeper trouble.

I'm sorry. I'm thinking about you, and sending prayers for you in this lousy road we all find ourselves on.

Carol----I think that taking Damon at the funeral was handled in the best possible way since he was so young. When my

Lisas died (at age 6 mo.) , my two older kids were in low elementary school. My mom brought them to the funeral home

for the wake. Years & years later, my son told me that it was the 'worst day of my life". He said "don't feel bad, Mom-----I

just mean that I was so very sad, that's all.".

PEACE TO ALL INDIGOS

Davey&Lisasmom, Sherry

[Guest msnher]

"Bless her little buttons". That is the cutest saying. I am going to adopt it as my own Sherry.

What a day. Crystal you have been in my heart and prayers all day. This is just a guess, but I would guess that the apple didn't fall far from the tree. Like mother like daughter. Feeling responsible for things neither of you had any control over. She is a strong soul and she is okay...she will be close by all of you through this. I wish there was an easier way to walk through grief, especially with your faith - which is strong, but there isn't an easy way through. Just know you don't walk alone.

Much love to all of you! Susannah/Stephanie's mom

[Crystal16]

Yes Susannah, Ashlee was a lot like me in many ways! She is very strong spirited and wants total control. I pray I can rest tonight the past two nights have been restless.

Love to all...

[Guest msnher]

I am in agreement with your prayer, Crystal. May the peace that passes all understanding envelope you in love and security so you will wake rested.

[kmb22]

I haven't been up for posting much these days, I feel like my feet are set in concrete and I'm living in a different place than everyone around me. I feel all talked out like I've accepted nothing I say will change a thing...ever.

Michelle – That’s such a difficult decision I’m glad you can all discuss it so you’re all in agreement. Sometimes I wish I could find anger again, it helped me through a lot of hard times…but I can’t. Each time I start to feel the rumbling, instant guilt. I can’t be angry when I know this was not his intent. The fact that this has happened to any of our children angers me though there seems to be no place to focus the anger except on the fact it happened and that I was completely helpless in stopping it.

Rhonda – Yes it is a shame those people do exist though I’m still unsure if it heartlessness or lack of compassion. I think of this quite a bit and it somewhat ties into your question of handling loss with our children. I often wonder if there is a connection of sheltering them from it and their ability to feel and show compassion later on.

Our need to protect our children sometimes leads us to keep painful things from them When my brother passed they knew but didn’t go to the service; they were young and had no relationship with him. As I’ve mentioned here before I was able to use it as an example of where addiction can lead. When my grandmother passed I also didn’t bring them. She had suffered from Alzheimer’s for years and often said things not appropriate for their young ears so they hadn’t ever formed a relationship. My boys were 9 and 13 the first time they attended a service and I would have done anything to have them not experience it but it was a young boy, a friend of Shawn’s from the neighborhood…they needed to go. We were fortunate to have an organization here call TIP; it’s a trauma intervention organization which helps children and their families during a tragic loss. They encouraged talking to them and encouraging them to ask any questions they have before going to the service. I had been so consumed with trying to comfort their pain I overlooked the fact they had never experienced this before. They had lots of thoughts, questions, and fears. I did the best I could to answer each one. I can’t say for certain if it helped but I watched both of my boys support friends through their painful losses afterward and though I know at times it was hard on them, they never ran. I honestly don’t know at what age I would have decided they could handle it, if given an option.

Crystal – I’m so sorry for your tears and I too hope justice is done. It’s impossible to know for sure what exactly happened but I have to agree there feels to be more to it. Have they done a lie detector by any chance? It would seem one likely option. I’m so sorry you still have so much to face in front of you but as Susannah said so well, you don’t walk alone.

Carol – I’ve shared that back of forth ritual between being organized and wishing so but now I also include I just don’t care and sometimes beat on myself that I used to care too much. Messy rooms, dirty clothes, dirty dishes, a ride here and a ride there…I’d do anything to have it all back. I love to hear your stories of Damon, and it’s nice to hear Sarah is doing such a wonderful job in raising him and keeping Mike present in his life. I’ve heard more snow then heard they aren’t too sure. I guess as usual in NE, we wait and see.

This is starting to get long and my thoughts are wandering a bit so I’ll end this for now.

Dee, Susannah, Sherry, Trudi, Amy, Betsy, Betty, Lorri, Beth, Colleen, Kathy, Bonnie, Greg, Dan, Leah, Sonya, Shelly, Lynn, Scherry, Claudia, Elaine, and all I’ve missed, I wish you all a peaceful night, love, and prayers.

[mikesmomrs]

I've been going through some thumb drives that I've had since I retired, and found this song...it is from the movie "Troy", which I haven't seen, but this song stirs my heart to the moon and back, and then some...just thought I'd share...

Remember, I will still be here

As long as you hold me, in your memory

Remember, when your dreams have ended

Time can be transcended

Just remember me

I am the one star that keeps burning, so brightly,

It is the last light, to fade into the rising sun

I'm with you

Whenever you tell, my story

For I am all I've done

Remember, I will still be here

As long as you hold me, in your memory

Remember me

I am the one voice in the cold wind, that whispers

And if you listen, you'll hear me call across the sky

As long as I still can reach out, and touch you

Then I will never die

Remember, I'll never leave you

If you will only

Remember me

Remember me...

Remember, I will still be here

As long as you hold me

In your memory

Remember, when your dreams have ended

Time can be transcended

I live forever

Remember me

Remember me

Remember... me...

love and peace to all, carol mikesmomrs

[kmb22]

Edit

[ericasmom]

I have not caught up with reading, just want to pop in and say thanks for your nice words Carol about the conference that I will be presenting, I sure wish I could look out and see your face shining there. Yes, I am a strangely random organizer, if there could be such a heading.

We had a great field trip yesterday, the art and the wonderful docents, the kids did well with some words now and again from me. Nobody pointed at the nudes and made jokes, they were prepared to see these and told what the expectation was. I am proud of them, Now if they could please learn to whisper when they chat among themselves. For some reason, we are seeing kids unable and never taught how to whisper. ODD!

Karen, sorry that you are feeling out there right now. I sure get it though.

Michellle, love that the dreads did well at the fair. Thanks for letting me in on it, it makes my heart smile to know that ERi is kind of hanging in Australia with you.

Crystal, what a difficult journey you are on, and I so wish I could find ways for you to fly over this next part in order to be able to be done with the guilt and the court room, but the process that we all find ourselves during that first year, two, three, is what gives us the strength you feel later on when we get a bit further on the road. Only way to do this is to go right through it. There will be days my Dear, you know that, where ones/ feet feel stuck in the horror for eternity, but you eventually will find yourself forward and some healing will have taken place. Peace one day Dear.

Sue, glad you will take my rough folding, be right there.

Beautiful music ladies, thanks for posting the words that will sing me through the day.

More later,

dee

[Guest msnher]

Dee - Good luck today, although I know you don't need luck. You are going to do just fine. I wish I could be there.

I love the words to the songs.

The daughter of the man whose four wheeler Stephanie was driving has posted a few more posts on Steph's memorial site, telling me about that day and how much fun they had together. Stephanie was like a mother to her, she said. Why do I resent that? Maybe because she wasn't like a mother to her own children? Argh! The girl said her father is in jail again. Argh! I realize this might be an opportunity to make a difference in a young girl's life but I don't have it in me to do so. I posted a thank you and told her we didn't know about her father until after Steph died and we were under the impression his children were much younger than her notes sound. I also told her that I am not ready to hear about that day and Steph's involvment with her family but I wished her love and peace and told her Steph would want her to be happy. It's things like that that bring my anger back towards Stephanie. She was supposed to be working on getting HER kids back. She had no business being in a relationship with anyone. She had no business driving this young girl around in OUR truck to the mall, to dinner, for icecream...etc. We paid her gas and we had an agreement that she wouldn't be driving her friends all over that she would just use the vehicle for visits to HER kids, work and church. Another lie disclosed. It's like finding the video's on her phone of everyone but her own children.

I don't know how old that girl is, but I hope she has someone she can talk to. I feel bad that I can't be that someone for her, but I just can't.

Thanks for listening.

Susannah/Stephanie's mom

[Crystal16]

Good morning Indigo family,

Susannah- Thanks for the prayer. I woke this morning feeling rested and my spirit was in better place.

Karen- Not sure what the detective and DA has done up to this point. The trial starts March 16^th to hear testimony from first responders and so on…. I saw the memorial you made for Shawn and his wife, it was beautiful.

Carol- Thank you for sharing the song. Ashlee wrote a poem that said “I am who I am” reminds me a little of those lyrics.

Dee- I too wish I could fly on the wings of an Eagle and be in the next season of this journey but God plans are bigger than I.

To the woman who sent encouraging words and prayers the past two day it was hard but I pressed into the pain and feel rested today. I thank God every day he led me to this website. Tonight I start my life group back up and I am blessed to have sisters in Christ come along side me and help me too through these dark days…

Lynn, Sherry, Trudi, Amy, Betty, Claudia, Elaine, Lorri, Beth, Colleen, Kathy, Bonnie, Greg, Sonya, Betsy, Dan, Leah, Shelly, and anyone I have missed, I pray you have a blessed day.

[ericasmom]

Thanks Sus, I am not presenting until Friday morning and again Saturday late afternoon.

Yesterday I did the whole teacher art institute thing, fun, then went to meet my old friend at her local doc. appt. She lives an hour out but needed a bit of support and then she and I went to a quick dinner as her doc appt. lasted 2 hours, then I met up with my niece to go see a great author Lynda Barry. If you ever have a chance to read some of her graphic stuff, do, she is not only a hoot, she is my same age, 54, and grew up in major dysfunction and has carved a wonderful life for herself. In fact Col, she is a wisconson-er.

Love to all, I am pooped! Kids are in gym, so I will run around and get ready for th eday.

loves

[ericasmom]

SUS, this just shows that everyone has a time or season to their own grieving. She is ready to talk for some reason, and it must feel very strange to you to read this now. I am sorry for what it may bring forward, but as far as feeling you should be able to help, please don't go there. You are doing a great deal right now with the three you are devoting your life to. Hang in there, maybe one day you will want to hear more, maybe not, today is the day to deal with. I think you handled it well.

[westleysmom]

Susannah-I think your reply was very kind and I'm sure that while you wrote it, if you smiled, your lips were closed. I agree with Dee, you are doing a great job with the kids, but you can't do anymore right now for anyone else without hurting yourself or the kids and those are your priorities. You have so much on your plate right now and I wonder how you do it all. It must be hard to keep your sense of humor, but I can tell you still have it from your posts. I think all of us suffer somewhat from save the world syndrome. I know I feel like I was unable to "save" Westley, and should try to redeem myself by "saving" somebody else. I don't know if its supposed to work that way or not, but it seems that's what I feel. So anyway, try not to feel bad about this girl or her dad. And in case it makes you feel better, I would be resentful too. I'm sorry this happened at all, but especially since Stephanie was at such a place in her life when things were still not settled.

Dee-Good luck on the conference. Parking fees in big cities are ridiculous, I can see why lots of people don't have cars with public transportation available. Out here in the boonies, if you want to go somewhere you have to drive or walk, and its 15 miles to my office from the house, so you can be sure I'm driving. But not today, we got another pretty deep snow and the highway dept is out of salt for this year. So the roads are quite treacherous and its a slow time at work. We were told yesterday it was coming, so I got all my stuff done. I may try to do so decluttering today. Do you all have cabinets that are full that you never use anything out of? I do, and I'm going to try to let go of some of the stuff I never use.

Karen-I love that song, I have that CD. It came out close to the time my Daddy was sick and dying, and I think that's why I liked it so much. Of course, now it speaks to me for entirely different reasons, although I guess the words sound more like romantic love, and my love for Daddy and Westley was not that, it still speaks to me. I hope you get out of your funk soon, I know though, that you can't really change how you feel. Take care.

Betty, Betsy, Colleen, Michelle, Trudi, Carol, Crystal, Sherry, Lorri, Lynn, Beth, Lisa, Marcia, Leah, everybody else, I hope you're having a good day and staying warm.

[ddefrain]

I had a dream about Loren last night. How does your mind "forget" that your child is dead? We were having a conversation in the dream, walking along the beach, and I felt so happy!! When I woke up, for just a moment I felt this elation, like everything else was just a bad dream and then the reality of his death hit me like a train wreck all over again. It has been 2 years January 4th, and in those 2 years I have never "forgotten" that my son is dead, not even in my dreams. I know my husband and I have had quite a bit on our plates lately, we have been taking care of our 4 year old granddaughter and 8 year old grandson since the end of November, my oldest son and daughter in law have relocated from Italy, and the grandchildren have been living with us while they took care of all the logistics. I think my husband and I have not had as much time to spend on grief work as maybe we should. At any rate, today it feels like I am back to square one. I was in a panic this morning just not wanting this to be true. Today, I am back to trying to fix it which I have not done in a while.

[mikesmomrs]

Sus, I agree with Rhonda and Dee...you are doing all you can and have your plate overflowing. And, as far as the resentment, I would wonder if you were a saint if you didn't have some... the note you wrote to the girl was from your heart...

Karen: I have a page on Mike's web site dedicated to his wife, Sarah, and Josh Groban's "I believe" is the song playing in the background. Sarah has told me that she often smells wood shavings...Mike used to work in a wood cutting shop, and would come home with the smell of wood shavings on him. She also smells "Sandalwood" essence, and we have had that experience also. So, "I believe" seemed totally appropriate for that page. (Sarah and I both smelled the Sandalwood the night we took Damon to see the Beatles Review concert, just as we entered the hallway. We were all alone, just the three of us, and it hit us as we opened the door, and then was gone, just like that. I believe. I have to.

Rhonda: We had cabinets that were full, and lots of things we never used, until we moved here...after almost 20 years in one house, we had built up a lot! MUCH went when we moved here, though. No basement here, so no storage options for us, or for our kids! (We had lots of stuff in the basement stored for them.) Most of my cabinets now hold only what we use, but I am sure the "non-used" stuff will build up again, eventually.

Dee: I am so glad your outing turned into an extended time for you, with visiting and supporting a friend and then your niece and seeing one of your favorite authors. I used to read a LOT, but over the years, find I can't keep my eyes open once I start a book, so it takes me nigh onto forever to finish one. And, of course, if I set it down for a while, I have to pretty much start over because all I've read has slipped through the cracks in my memory.

We have Damon today, and he hasn't been able to get out in the snow much because it has been so very cold that it was dangerous. Today it is in the low 20's, so when we got home, I let him play out front in the snow, which was up past his knees and very soft...it didn't deter him one bit...he trudged through the whole yard, front, side and back...He was like a little doggy out there, romping everywhere. It was such fun to watch him...wore me out just watching!

We have been putting a few VHS tapes that we have of home movies onto DVD's and came across one that Kim had had made professionally for us a while back that we had forgotten about...it was a montage of photos put onto a VHS tape...it started with myself and Ralph, from kids to when we got married, then each of our kids, beginning with her, random shots as they grew up. For some reason, she had smatterings of pics of her and Cathi, but for Mike, along with some others, she had each one of his school pics, from Kindergarten through high school. A few years ago, before Mike died actually, we had to throw quite a few pictures away...they were in a wooden box/coffee table we had in front of the sofa, and someone had spilled milk into it at one point and didn't realize it had gone all the way through to the inside. When we found them, a very long time later, they had mildewed terribly, stuck together, and were totally unsalvable. The biggest chunk of them were Mike's school pics...we totally forgot about the tape she had made previously, until we came across it the other day. It was such a wonderful surprise and gift to find that every one of his school pictures was on it. Many tears, but gratitude also, for all the memories they evoked.

I hope everyone has had a good day...at least moments where you've had a wonderful memory find its way into your heart, and had it warm you soul, even if only for a moment.

love and peace,

carol mikesmomrs

[mikesmomrs]

Debra: I am so sorry that you had such a letdown when you awoke from your beautiful dream about your Loren...it is such a comfort to have those kinds of dreams, but such a piercing pain when we awaken, still in a sleep state, yet somehow aware that our reality is different, and then, boom, we are back in that reality, our hearts feeling as though they have been broken all over again! It sounds as though you do indeed have your plates full with having your grandkids there full time. I think we all have to continually work on grieving, and there is no timetable as you know. Sending hugs to you, holding you close in my heart.

love and peace,

carol mikesmomrs

[ericasmom]

I am with Carol on this Debra, those dreams that allow you the beauty and grace can leave you so shattered sometimes. Once in a while however, you have a dream/visit that lets you feel good all day. I know that the ups and downs are more than most would ever imagine, but it is our daily dance. I promise that it will become a bit more smooth later on down the road. Hang on. Blessings. Have you a photo of Loren that you want to share? Just keep talking here with us Deb, we are here for all you may want to say and shout, we can hold on to you on those darkest days and we will rejoice with you on those days that are not as dark.

Michelle, I never finished telling you that I loved your idea for the headstone. Perfectly stated My Dear.

[daveydow1]

Susannah----My Gram used to say that--------"Bless your buttons"....I always felt special when she said it

to me. She's long since passed away....... and was the one I loved so much.

I think, too, that you were kind & gracious in your reply to the girl who posted messages to you, and you were

honest in telling her that you were not open to hearing all about the things she may tell you. You have a lot

on your plate right now......and doing such a wonderful job of loving and nurturing Stephanie's dear children.

You most likely feel that you would not want to 'open up' new 'floodgates' (for lack of a better way of putting it.)

It's true that what this girl might have told you would be the unknown, and could lead you down a road to more

pain. While she may even be thinking that you would be eager to hear what she had to relate,......you kindly said that

you were not open to that at this time. I send prayers , friend.

Debra-----I am sorry that the dream you had of Loren caused you such a letdown. I, too, have had a few dreams

like that. So painful and sorrowful. I guess that our minds never can forget that our children are dead. Even though

we fervently wish, with all our hearts, that it were not true. Please keep coming to BI. Everyone here understands

the pain you are feeling. Peace & comfort to you.

Dee-----The trip to the art gallery must have been very rewarding for the students. How 'cute' that they were given a

little 'pep talk' before going, so that they knew what to expect, and what was expected from THEM in the way of

manners/behaviour. (especially when viewing the nudes art ). Not being a teacher, I would not have thought of

that ( the talk).........which could then have lead to who knows what ?? . I'm sure that many of the kids will

always remember the experience. Did you all go down by bus??

PEACE & TRANQUILITY TO ALL.

Davey&Lisasmom, Sherry

[shorty16]

Hello to my fellow Indigos

Trudi – How cool that you are putting VHS tapes onto CD’s. That is a project. Scott does a good job with our photos. Each kids has a book. I read your poem and the words “I am all I have done” made me think (laugh), that Brian must have spent some time in the corner, before God allowed him to play with others - HAHAHAH

Ddefrain – I have done that!! And it was between the 1-2 year mark. I have no answers why?, but it did happen to me too.

Sus – I can totally understand why it bothers you this girl posted on Steph’s memorial page. That is a very special place for you. Thinking of you, my friend.

Dee – Chicago has great art museums. I have taken my mother and my kids to Chicago 3X via the train. I am so glad you and the kids had a good time. Art makes me think of things in such a different way. My job is so technical and art allows my mind wander.

Crystal – You are on a tough journey. The court process can be so cold and very draining. When I was in court, I would picture all the angels here surrounding me, with their hands on my shoulders-especially when I was doing our speech. Since the avatar’s here are usually pictures of our kids, I knew what the angels looked like. I would pray and pray to the Lord to send those children to me – it helped me, but the experience is very draining. Hang in there my friend – I have asked Brian to surround you with love and to ask the other angels to do so also.

Karen – You are such a good Mom and you seem to be surrounded difficult situations; the voice of reason amid the noise. I am with you, my friend. Sometimes we have to protect our kids from their own family members. Scott’s brothers are both alcoholics enabled by his mother. Both those boys live within 5 miles of their Mom and Scott has to drive 2 hours to help his Mom maintain her house-really a sad situation.

Rhonda – I think the thought that “I could not save my son, so maybe I can save this kid) was huge in me when we took-in Trevor. I thought if I just loved and trusted him that all would work out – how wrong I was. You are a great Mother and neither of us should think “since I could not save my son”. Both our kids made decisions that ended their lives. Neither went into the situation knowing that. If you figure out how to stop blaming ourselves for this, let me know.

I would not be near as far in my grief process if I had not found this website. Giving back to the newbies is something I want to do, because it helped me more than you will ever know.

Love to:

Betty, Betsy, Michelle, Trudi, Carol, Crystal, Sherry, Lorri, Lynn, Beth, Lisa, Marcia, Leah, Amy, Claudia, Elaine, Kathy, Bonnie, Greg, Sonya, Dan, Shelly

Colleen, Brian’s Mother Forever

[ericasmom]

Hey Col, good to see your posts. You have been rather quiet and I wondered how you were doing. You are right, art and artistic endeavors do enliven ones brain and spirit. SO do allow yourselves to play and do art and write, nobody has to see it if you don' t want to share it, but doing it is th ebiggest part. Allowing that part of your brain to be engaged is quite a good thing, it is then using the part of the brain that usually has to sit quietly by and do little. The woman I listened to last evening, Lynda Barry a Wisconsin-er, tallks about playing deeply, deep play where children are interacting with toys or nature in an act of deep play. They can become unaware of the surroundings as they undergo the scen changes and character changes in their play. All of that is like nutrition is for your body, mind building, and creativity building...one must allow and encourage deep play. For we adults it may come int he form of a long bike ride, or listening to music while we draw, or knitting, an activity that causes us to use our hands adn body and builds the brian. Ahh, deep play time.

Sherry it was great when we got to a room with many nudes, I saw the children use thier furrowed brow looks, as though they were thinking deeply, and one child stood before the Delacroix (i think) for a long long time. He was staring at a huge canvas of naked women all walking from the woods. Finally he said, so did people have to pose for that?

Funny, and I said no, this was in his imagination, kind of like a dream.

The museum looked great, many wonderful exhibits and friendly people everywhere.

I am extra tired today, what a busy day it was. Conferences coming up next week, ALREADY?

Love to all,

[summergirl]

Hello Dear Indigo's - just a quick stop in to say hello. My anger has left and has been replaced by tears and a saddness so deep it hurts my soul. This coming up 5 year angelversary is taking its toll on me and I am struggeling to stay afloat. I have been keeping very busy, quilting, working on kitchen curtains but keep changing my mind on what I want, baking......all things that I think will keep my mind from wandering but no matter what I do it is there...At work I am in the midst of tears at any given time and my wonderful co-workers are so very understanding and I am grateful for that. Needed to share...

Dee - thank you for putting the song on by "Snow Patrol" - "Chashing Cars" - it is nice to know that someone else hears the same song and it hits them the same way...sort of a connection.

I have read the posts and my heart is with all and my thoughts also. I am being quiet as I just have no words of wisdom and no energy to help anyone, I am useless right now. I love you all and talk soon.

Oh yeah, another 6 - 10 inches of snow again tonight....getting real tired of white stuff but on the other hand I love the isolation.

[quellsmom]

Just stopping by to read and to send some love. In that ready to fight mood. Railing at God, mother nature for all this snow and everything in between.

Love to all, Lisa

[ericasmom]

Hey Lisa, good to know that you are there, that you hang with all of us. Are you doing OK? Well you know what I mean, I know not really OK, but... tell us how you are.

Kathy, five years hits hard, it just does. Such a mark of time. That is the year I had shirts made for everyone at ERI-FEST. I had 5 years is a long road... and a drawing of a road to a horizon line and then ERI-fest 2003-2007. It was done in pink and black on white shirts.

I know that the tears must fall, so be it. I am glad that those you work with are being supportive. How is Tav doing? Is there another snow day called?

Sleep well All, I am heading to bed with prayers on my lips and in my heart for each of us here, as I drift.

[ericasmom]

Carol love the words to that song adn Karen, another song filled to the brim with ache and love. I am sorry for the sense of living in an alternate universe. I do know taht I felt that way for a while, and once in a while still do but not so often now. I am glad you raised your boys Karen to not run away or turn their cheek when someone is in need. Strong lessons learned young allowed them to be there for others.

Carol, the photo of Damon is lovely, the weather doesn't deter him and in fact, it inspires him. Hooray for Damon.