Loss of an Adult Child

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[heartbeataway]

Good Morning!

I haven't been able to login for a while. Wouldn't accept my login.

I just tried doing it using a new search engine and it worked!

The holidays and our legal challenges have just about pushed me over the edge ....... and I know you guys understand that!

So, i know I'm a wee bit late but I'm still going to say the new year is here ...... and I hope it brings healing, health and prosperity to each one of you!

[rlolheiser]

Bonnie! it so so great to see you here again.. you have been missed and thought of so very much.

Coleen, don't kick yourself, you did fantastic with Trevor and I am sure Brian is happy for what you did for him. Maybe there isnt anything you can see now, but you gave him something to compare life with later. I know 17 is a hard age for troubled boys. My grandson who will be 18 in just 10 days, has left home, he was so respectful to me, but to my daughter or anybody else he is just not caring. I can only pray that they find their way in life. You did what you could, you went above and beyond what anybody else would and I am sure that somewhere in his heart he is thankful for that. Now he has to learn his way for awhile. I just pray he decideds to get on a good path, as I do for my grandson.

I am doing well.. never fails.. I get online and somebody wants me.. mom just got up. I am starting to think she waits for my computer to go on and she decides it is time for me to tend to her :-).. oh well. I will try later

take care all, I am thinking of you

[ericasmom]

BONNIE! I wiped my eyes to see if I was imagining Jason's beauty smile this morning...so glad to see you but sad to hear that the courts have been driving you crazy...so sorry about that. Happy New Year nevertheless, and in fact, Happy New Year extra special wishes so that perhaps this new year can bestow a more peaceful scene for you and Rich.

Karen, it sounds like the young man is feeling the weight of so much loss and hasn't a sounding board and came to you for that. It is an extra burden to you but also testament that it is what he felt with Shawn that he feels from you too. I hope that he will go to a therapist to unload the years of loss he has kept under lock for too long. At 25, he very well may be ready to open up, it is such a threatening thought for many, especially younger than that. I am sending my good thoughts to him hoping that as the one in the photo that is still present- stops being something to feel guilty for, or lonely from, and begins to feel like a chance to live in their light. Such a tall order I know, but it is after all what our angels would like.

As far as the event that found your other Son allowed to drive...I too would have felt angered but would have kept it to myself as you did for the same reasons. Sometimes we just have to go against the instincts that have in the past guided us well in order to keep the peace. Blessings Karen.

As far as feeling happiness, laughing, enjoying a day, going to bed feeling as though you have had a good day? It will happen though you may fight it for all the reasons that have been stated, the biggest one again, GUILT! HOwever, once again, we all know that our Babies would want very much for each of us to find our rhythm and build anew, to allow the light to seep into the cracks of our grief whenever possible, widening those cracks eventually and letting our new-self emerge. Never ever will that mean you have forgotten, nor will it ever mean that you are turning your back on the sadness of this incredible Loss. Never. What I found that first year was that when I made myself stop replaying the sequence of events that took Eri from us, I found that I had more space in me for the joy of who Erica is. I took up so much space in my spirit with the phone call, the hospital, the little room, the sitting bedside to my girl, the machines, the sounds and smells, the tears of others....and I had to actually teach myself that I was not going to replay that for a half hour, then an hour, then for the evening, then for the afternoon and evening. It was hard, i mean really hard to reprogram my brain, heart, soul, to not hit the replay button. It was however the best thing I could do and I feel that ERi was saying, "YES MOMMA, that's it, Live in it, live in that little bit of light you are finding. Bathe in the daily antics fo the students, remember me in the day in ways that are good, but don't stay in the dark Momma, it will make me sad"

I do know the fight your heart will have with your sense of propriety, but remember who this CHILD is and ask yourself what would this Child want for us?

[Guest msnher]

Good morning Indigo's!

Bonnie, so good to see Jason's face this morning! I wonder how many others are having trouble getting on that we don't know about. Eric is trying to get Marcia on. She misses us and has tried several times to log on. I know the Beyond Indigo administrators don't want any of us to not be able to get here because of the glitches in the "system". A special thanks to Eric, Konnie and Kelly and anyone else who keeps this site up and running for us.

For Stephanie's first birthday in heaven I made her favorite foods and we released balloons. Her birthday was more difficult than her angelversary. I would not have been able to be part of a "party" as such that first year. However, a party is exactly what Stephanie would have wanted to be a part of. She would have seen it as an honor FOR her not disrespectful of her. If we lost my son, God forbid, he would expect his wife to invite all his friends and put on a party for him. I know he would. It would be difficult to pull off than staying home, safe in my home, but she would do it out of respect for him. She would also understand that I wouldn't be able to attend, and if I did, it would only be for a few moments. I adore my daughter in law and I know she loves my son. Any celebrating she did would not be done because he was gone, but because he lived. I certainly would want my family to party on my birthday, after I'm gone. Let them remember me with laughter in their hearts.

Love you all,

Susannah

[briansdad]

I've listened to this song a hundred times and it hit me different today. Miss Ya B

[ericasmom]

Greg, I am listening to your posted song choice, love it, have always loved Moody Blues and yes, this song sings to our wounded hearts. I do believe we will find them again one day and that they find us everyday, giving a wink and a nod to our days. Thanks for the pretty music to sing us through the morning.

Sus, yep, a party indeed, celebrating the human that left, their life and love, and celebrating the human spirit of strength in the saddest of times. Strength to me means looking smack in the face of what it is we are feeling and acknowledging it as it unfurls and twists us into a new life. Strength to me means telling the folks that are around us exactly what it is we are and are not able to do, and honoring our new-tender spots.

Lorri, I am missing you, just let us know if you are out there.

As far as others having trouble getting on this site, I sure hope that that is resolved soon.

Love you all so much

[Guest msnher]

Rambling re: Martin Luther King jr..

The topic at the breakfast table this morning was Martin Luther King Jr...who he was and what he represented and how he died. Keep in mind that Jonathon is part African American and Mariah is Puerto Rican. We talked about slavery and how the civil war ended it but did not end the oppression of black people. We talked about how white people (not all white people) did not allow black people to drink from the same water fountain, eat in the same restaurants, sit in the front of the bus or go to the same schools. We talked about what Mr King represented....peaceful demonstration. We talked about using our words, not our fists or weapons. We talked about the boycott of riding the busses as peaceful demonstration that worked. We talked about never judging someone by the color of their skin but instead by their character and the way they live their lives.

Brings to mind my own experience that I've shared here before, but want to share again. In honor of Martin Luther King Jr and in honor of my sister, Chris...four years my senior.

We moved around a lot as children, even before foster homes. During this specific time, we lived in Long Beach California. I was in first or second grade. We were considered poor, white trash. It was a tense time in our nation, in Long Beach and in our home. My step brother had just been drafted for the Vietnam war. I remember two men in suits coming to our house to find him because he went AWOL. To my knowledge, noone has ever heard from him again to this day. The Beach Boys were popular. "Girl Watcher" sun glasses and bell bottoms and white lipstick were all the rage. We lived right off of Main Street. Two street over was the "black" neighborhood. It was a scary time. I thought all black people hid razor blades in their afro hair. I was afraid of the differences between us. I was curious about their hair. There was one little black girl in my class who always wore the cutest clothes and her hair was fixed perfectly in braids and ponytails. I longed to just touch her hair. I was too afraid of her to ask her, though. She had dark brown eyes that looked at me with the same suspicion I felt towards her. We never spoke to each other.

This had to be after Martin Luther King was killed, because these were the days of riots and fear of each other. Integration at the schools had begun because their were the school busses that brought the black kids to our schools. In those days we called them Negro's or colored kids.

Yes, I was afraid of them at school or in the stores or in their neighborhood. But, in MY neighborhood I was brave and stupid.

One Saturday, I was playing in my friends front yard, right across the street from my house. My sister, Chris, was sitting on the front porch with my other sister, Dessie. The little black girl must have been lost. She was probably in sixth grade...I was brave for my 7yr old self. Black people rarely came on our street. "Get off of MY street, you N------!" I yelled as she dare peddle her bike on our sidewalk.

She was off her bike and on top of me in a flash. Before she her fist made contact with my face, she was quickly pulled off of me. My sister had ahold of her and said, "Just go" to the little girl. Chris had a very intimating presence and a reputation for being able to fight. She beat a boy up once and that reputation followed her. The little black girl got on her bike and rode off. Chris then began to give me a licking I'll never forget. She beat the N word right out of me. "Never let me hear you use that word again! Do you hear me?" She was about 11 or 12 and she beat the hell out of me! She made me sit on the front porch the rest of the day and didn't allow me off.

My older sisters were my only source of discipline and/or nurturer before foster homes. If my mother was home, she was usually passed out drunk on the sofa or in her bed.

Then, there's the memory of Martin Luther King being shot. His death would find us living in Tonopah Nevada. I am unsure if the above event happened before he died or after. But, I remember his funeral. Same sister, Chris, made me watch it with her in our Grandma's living room, on her black and white television set. Chris made me stand with my hand on my heart, quietly staring at the television set, as the funeral procession made it's way. I remember doing what I was told out of fear of my sister and watching with wonder as they carried the casket, surrounded by more "colored" folk than I'd ever seen. I wasn't allowed to ask questions...Chris made me be quiet, standing there, with my hand on my heart.

My sisters and I would soon be separated and placed in foster homes, in the custody of the Mormon church and moved to Las Vegas Nevada. At that time, the Mormons didn't allow blacks to hold the priesthood or marry in their temples. We were taught that there was a war in heaven, before the world was made. We were taught that we had a mother in heaven and a father in heaven that gave us spiritual life, but we had to be born physically, so they made earth. We were taught that Jesus and Satan were our elder brothers and that Satan said he would come to earth and make sure that all of Father's children would make it back to Father and Mother and none would be lost but Satan wanted all the glory. Then Jesus stood up and said he would go down and set an example and we could have free will and decide for ourselves and the glory would be to the Father.

Some chose Jesus. Some chose Satan's side. There was a huge war. Jesus side won. Satan's side was cast out with all who fought with him. Those who fought in the front lines with Jesus were born to white families. Those who fought really hard were born to white families in the United States to Mormon families. The darker the skin, the less they fought. We were taught that Black people didn't fight at all. They sat on the fence undecided. The demons, obviously, chose Satan's side. As punishment to the souls that did not fight, but sat on the fence, they were "cursed" with darker skin. The whiter the skin, the harder they fought. That's why blacks couldn't hold the priesthood. Sometime during the 80's (I think) their prophet, President Kimball, received a revelation that Blacks could now hold the priesthood and marry in the temple. Very nice of God, dontcha think?

Then there's the story I was told about Cain and Abel. Cain killed Abel and so as a curse to him for killing his brother, whom God loved so much, His skin was made black and all his offspring would have the same curse. Supposedly it was a loving act of God to curse his skin black.

ARGH!!!! Can you see where all the idea of white supremacy could be established?

Pisses me right off!!! But, I bought into it then. During one of my foster homes, in Las Vegas, I developed a crush on a black boy. He was nice to me and very handsome. I went to the bishop and confessed my sin for liking a black boy. I think I had to abstain from taking the sacrament (communion) for a month as punishment for liking an African American.

Sure glad I got over that nonsense before Denzel Washington or Will Smith came on the scene!

Now my prejudice and lack of tolerance isn't for those of different skin color, it's for the religious right. Obviously, I left the Mormon church years ago.

I had no idea I would ever be raising African American children...and, I hope they will never know racial tension and/or profiling.

Susannah/Stephanie's mom

[ericasmom]

I grew up in a very diverse neighborhood in Chicago my first 11 years, diverse with all cultures except black. Latino, asisan, eastern european, about 60 different languages spoken in our public school. I loved it, but wondered why no blacks were with us. Finally, some black families were moving inot our northside neighborhood, so of course, we moved.

When we moved in 1968, the most turbulent year in Chicago, I was suddenly thrust into a white, I mean WHITE neighborhood. I hated it. It was all the same, almost all of use were Italian, and some were Irish or German...nobody else. Hated it. Our town eventually changed and I was happy about that, but my parents were not. I brought a friend home one day, Eric, who was black as Sidney Potier, my father stood and actually told our dog to attack. I quickly took Eric outside adn walked him home to his brown skinned neighborhood where I felt quite at home. Sad example of who raised me, but I went totally opposite because that kind of hatred was painfully ugly. I was in 6th grade when Martin Luther King Jr. was killed, murdered. I wept/ still do when I think of the events that took him away.

Sus, Jonathon might love the book, IF The Bus Could Talk. Lovely book. Also Tar Beach, also anything by Exra Jack Keats as the little boy depicted is a wonderful little brown-skinned boy named Peter. Whistle for Willie and Snowy Day are my favorites. It is very important for all children to see kids like them depicted in positive ways in picture books.

[Guest msnher]

I grew up claiming I was Mexican. Seriously. My grandfather was raised by Mexicans and his features looked Mexican. All the relatives from his side of the family were Mexican. People would ask my nationality and I proudly told them Mexican. Me and my blond, blue eyed self. Then my sister did our geneology and found out we have no Mexican in us. Grandpa was just raised by a Mexican family. I was sincerely disappointed! One of my favorite lines is from Steve Martin (can't remember the movie) "I was born a poor, black boy". Well, I was born a poor, mexican girl.

My explanation for my white skin was I was so valiant in the pre existence. LOL Oh, I hope God appears as a huge black man! Of course, if he does come back and IF Joseph Smith is standing on his right side (as I was taught) I'm going to say, "Oh ****!"

[Guest msnher]

Thanks for the book recommendations, Dee. I will definitely add them to our library!

[Guest msnher]

Just the trailer of Rabbit Hole brought deep sobs. I think I'll wait until it's out on DVD to watch it in the privacy of my home.

[summergirl]

Colleen - as everyone else here has said - you did the best you could with Trevor, more than alot of others would have done. I am sorry from my heart that it did not work out but I am glad that you found out before anything serious happened in your home and with your son. We do the best we can and that is all we can ask of ourselves so please do not beat yourself up - there are those who choose to change and those who choose not too. I know telling you that does not make it any easier.....prayers

Dee - thank you for writing to Tavian about the little bird - so very sweet and sure made him smile.

Barry and I went out for a bit last night and saw a bunch of friends....everyone kept telling me that I looked really good, that I looked happy - something they had not seen in a long time !! The only response I had for them was "Since we have moved I feel as though I have come home and I have found a peace that has not been there since Jessica left" - I am not saying I do not have the pain each day and the tears but I am more at peace with my life. I have been getting back to doing things that I have not done since Jessica left and I cannot explain it - I just know that it feels good.

Tavian is at Damien's house for a sleepover so I am actually getting some quiet time and enjoying it. Made a big pot of Turkey soup for dinner, made mince-meat cookies (YUK - for Barry) and chocolate chip cookies for Tavian so now it is mi-mi time. Watching movies and on my laptop.

Greg - I want to go see the "Rabbit Hole" also, I am not sure how I will handle it but I am sure I want to try. If I go before you I will let you know my reaction.

I am sorry for any birthdays or Angelversary that I have missed.....I think of all of you so often, always in my heart.

Have a restful, peaceful night...much love, Kathy

[aim630]

Susannah-I'm pretty sure that line is from "The Jerk". I like to think that kids today are more "color-blind" than previous generations. Of course, I am saying this from a white standpoint, obviously not knowing how black people feel.

Some of both Ashley & Katie's best friends are black. My parents, on the other hand, were/are pretty racist. My grandmother refused to be treated by a black doctor. I don't understand that at all. My dad was the nicest guy in the world, and I think that was one of his only faults, but he was raised that way, so thought that was the right way. I went to a very small, Catholic school for 8 yrs. There were only about 20 kids in each grade. There was one black boy in the entire school, and he had been adopted by a white family. We were all good friends, but that was really the only black person I knew until I went to high school. Both of my kids would get very upset when their grandparents made some kind of racist remark. I'm glad that you are discussing Martin Luther King with your grandkids. Katie was so funny when she was little. She told me her favorite month was February because it is black history month (with her light brown hair & green eyes). I am glad that she (& Ashley) see people as people, not a specific color. I am currently reading a free book on my kindle called "Fireflies in December". I'm not very far into it yet, but it is about a white family living in the south in the 30's who take in a black orphaned girl, and the town is very against this, and have a local KKK. It makes me so angry just reading this fictional book to think how bad black people were/are treated. We still have a very long way to go in this country.

Greg-I too, have listened to that song many times, without actually paying attention to the words. It made me cry this time when I listened to it.

All seems fine with Katie and her best friend now. Just a misunderstanding, I guess. I just hate to see her unhappy, especially because she's had more to deal with than most other kids.

Dee-Driving home from a shopping trip today, I started reliving Ashley's last day again. Every time I do, it tears me apart. I try to drive the thoughts away, but it is so hard. Such guilt that I could have done something differently. Katie asked me today how the doctors could save Gabby Giffords who got shot through the brain, but couldn't save Ashley. I told her I don't know why, just sometimes things happen that no one expects. I'm glad Eri was able to make you start to see the good things more than the bad. Hopefully some day I'll get there too.

Goodnight all, hope everyone had a good day.

Amy/Ashley's mom

[ericasmom]

Oh Amy, I hope my suggestion does not imply that there aren't days when I too go back and replay every last detail, but for the most part, I don't anymore. I would say that somewhere by the middle of our second year without Eri, I had regained so much more light than there had been there for a long while. I usually tried to do something physical when the urge to replay came. Before that however, there was no urge, it was just like breathing, involuntary. I just always saw the events playing out in my mind, over and over as though on a loop. It does take time to work through, and there are times that you need to let the replay go on for what ever reasons, but eventually, reducing the amount of time spent there did certainly help me, my spirit.

I know what Katie is asking, I thought too, wow, such a big brain injury for Gabby and yet there she is wiggling toes adn bending her arms and getting stronger...Eri's brain injury just could not heal. Maybe one day the doctors will be able to fix injuries such as Eri's and heal illnesses such as Ashley's, I do hope so. The girls will dance on clouds when that happens.

Kath, tell Tavian that I am glad that he is a bird lover, nature loving boy.

I am very happy to know that you are feeling so at home.

[daveydow1]

Rhonda---You are so right------we always feel that we should not survive our children. When we 'talk' to ourselves, and tell

ourselves that our child would not want us to be forever sorrowful and crying about their deaths.....that makes sense to us.

But----on the other hand, .....our pain and devastation is another matter entirely, and we cannot always 'chase away' those

sad times.....missing them.....guilt....and all the other emotions we feel. I guess we must...no matter where we are on the

timeline after their death....just take it each day as it comes. Sounds easy..., but we all know how grindingly difficult it is.

Peace & comfort to you, friend.

Sonya----So good to see Danielle's million dolllar smile.

Bonnie-----Glad that you found a way back to BI. Nice to see Jason's handsome face.

Leah-----Sending prayers that your grandson will somehow find his way to a good path.Thanks for the get well wishes.

Kathy-----I'm glad to hear that you are finding peace in your new home. Are you all settled in now ?

Greg---Thanks for the song.......Always loved the Moody Blues music.

Amy-----Oh,....I think that guilt is just a part of this journey. We all feel responsible for our children, and when they die, we feel

as though we must have failed in some way. I have always felt guilty about Davey's death because my husband and I were

not able to help him do some of the things he wanted so badly to do.....like college etc. He would have been a nontraditional

student, of course, because he did not seem interested in going to school directly out of high school......only later on after

several dead end jobs and all. Even though we, as parents, know that we were not to blame for their deaths, that little part

somewhere in the back of our minds seems to nag at us with doubt....the guilt. But, I do believe that with time, the feelings

get 'softer', and we can see it more objectively. I hope that Katy and her girlfriend will have a nice time.

Dee-----I agree that it is time that helps us on the grief path......to ease the overwhelming sorrow and shock of reliving our dear

children's death. Of course, as humans, we are impatient with time, and sometimes see it as an enemy. But, we also realize

that we have no control over time. After these 7 1/2 yrs. sometimes I just sit and wonder how I made it this far. One minute, hour,

day, at a time.....I guess that's how we go. Your celebration for ERi's first birthday after she became an angel sounds so nice. I

thought to do something like that, but my husband would not have wanted it, so I just let it go. Talking to Davey is one of my

best ways of healing. An old-time doctor of mine told me ....."Just talk to him". It was about the best advice I received from anyone.

I still have the 'cold' part of the flu that keeps hanging on,....but you know how it is-----one cannot just lay around indefinitely---

there are things we must do, and things to take care of, so I get up and go. Take care.

Davey&Lisasmom, Sherry

[ericasmom]

Sherry, I am sorry that you have been ill. I must have missed a post about this and i apologize for not noting it. Have you had the whole fever thing too? Has your husband also been ill? Poor you, please take good care of yourself. Wish I could make you a pot of soup.

I agree with everything you said about time and guilt, it all goes along with the devastation of losing our Kids. It is an individual process to be sure, no time line will fit another human the same way. It is as you said, one moment at a time.

Today I went to a birthday party at a nursing home for my dear Betty Reith, age 90. She is the grandmom of Jon and Eri. Her daughter Carol flew in from the east coast and with her brothers, arranged to cater a brunch for her birthday. Several of Betty's fellow Nursing Home patrons came, as did some of her old friends from the neighborhood she and Max used to live. Jonathan introduced his Girl Shannon to his Grammy and she studied Shan for some time telling her how pretty she was and how happy she was for them to be engaged. It was such a nice day. Later, I went to Pat's house, which was Betty's home when she was still moving around without needs, and we shared another meal there. I have overeaten today, but what the heck. It was mighty good to spend some time with Carol, she and I went out to dinner last night and caught up with each other. We always pick up where we left off. We always laugh and cry and have endless stories to share. She misses ERi and she misses her brother Mike very much. Her husband has been in a nursing home back in Plymouth for several years now: Parkinsons. She is one tough cookie, with a wondrous heart.

Well all, sleep like a child who spent the day outside, dream beautifully. I am going downstairs to make some sleepy time tea and hit the sack.

Love and prayers

[ericasmom]

Hi and Good morning,

Well I for one did not sleep and dream as I hoped I would and hoped for Everyone else. Bad dreams. So hopefully, the rest of you did better.

Sub-zero temps coming our way by Thursday, so to whomever gets the blast of cold first, I wish you warmth.

[westleysmom]

Dee-I dreamt of Westley and it wasn't really good or bad. I could see him, as we were going about doing something, but it was as if he was just helping, not hearing us or interacting with us, like he couldn't hear us. I took him by the shoulders and forced him to look at me and pointed at my eye, and then my heart, and then to him. I said I Love You, really loud, as if that would help him to hear me. And he kind of smled, and said "I know that Mom", and then kept on with what he was doing. He was younger , maybe 12 or 13 in my dream. If there was more I can't remember it. His funeral was on a Sunday, 52 Sundays ago. How can that be? How do I keep going now that the year has come and gone? I have no real idea what I did all year long. When I think back and try to remember, I just remember crying and that's pretty much it. My mother told my daughter that I didn't talk anymore to her, did I talk to Amy? That I don't talk enough. I guess you can't fool your Mama. I don't know why I try, and apparently I don't try hard enough. I feel spent, tired and empty. And hopeless, much as I hate to admit it. I'm thinking of you all today and hoping that you all are having a good day. Today is the day we would have celebrated Westley's 22nd birthday, and I can't get that out of my mind. I'll go to the cemetery later, and maybe take some of the flowers out of my arrangement that I got to put on his grave.

Oh, and I'm glad you had a good day with your husband's family , it sounds nice.

[ericasmom]

Rhonda, feeling hopeless is not uncommon, we have all had bouts of it, but in those early stages where I feel you are, as we all were at thati one year mark, hopeless is a very familiar notion. The dream though does tell you that he knows, HE KNOWS that you love him, he will always know. Your Momma and you? WEll that relationship is made different by the loss, not that the love is different, but since everything is different, so is that. It is not that you are not trying enough Rhonda, it is that grief is exhausting, and doing anything more that getting through the day is a ridiculous endeavour. Eventually, more will be added to your days, but now? You have just faced that very hard point of 365 days. Looking forward is not any different right now than looking backward, though I will stand to remind you that the steps you have laid down are part of the process, you may not see the imprint of your work but it is in you, it is in the words you share with us, those encouraging words shared and those moments of despair, all part of the process of moving forward. Is today Westley's actual birthday Rhonda, if so I apologize for not having noted it already.

Let me know.

Love you, just breathe and just allow your grief, fighting it is a use of all your energy without the results you desire. Only one way through it, and it is through it. Not around or under. It is okay to just cry and scream and vent, how else can you get to the next good moment if you don't allow the despair?

[westleysmom]

Dee-Westley's actual birthday is the 19th, but at my MILs we celebrate birthdays usually on the closest Sunday because we are all together on Sundays for lunch. And I've just been unable to get ready to go to church, we had the funeral service at our church because its closer to the cemetery, and larger than the chapel at the funeral home. So going there today brings back so many memories, I just don't think I can do it. Most Sundays it doesn't even occur to me that right up there at the front of the church is the last place I ever saw his face or kissed it. But today, I can't get the memories out of my mind. It seems that I should just lock myself away from the 13th to the 19th in a way, but there have been moments in the last few days that I felt okay, just not many. I know you've been there and lived through it, as have most of the people here, and it gives me hope, but I still don't feel equal to the task set before me, the chore of living, and living well. Thanks for listening and being there, sometimes I still feel so alone and isolated, and that I am not doing anything right. Like everything I ever did was wrong because it led me here, to where I find myself now. You know how people say they wouldn't change a thing because everything that ever happened brought them to where they are right now, and its so wonderful? I feel the exact opposite, everything I've ever done brought me here? I'd change it all to not be here right now. I know that's not true, if I changed it all, I might never have been Westley's Mom, but you know what I mean, MOST of it all. I feel so confused sometimes, I don't want to go forward and I can't go back. I just feel very weepy today and will be glad when it is time to go to bed again.

[Guest msnher]

Hugs to you Rhonda. I have walked where you are. Sometimes I'm still there. I understand wishing we were anywhere but where we are. And, in the same breath knowing we wouldn't change a thing. It is not even an opinion, yet, just a thought or idea I'm entertaining...what if it's not just our mind that remembers? What if it is every particle of our DNA that remembers, too? And, what if the pain we experience when the date of the most painful experience of our life rolls around is actually our bodies way of honoring the process?

I know it sounds corny. But, we were in so much shock when our child first died and our bodies protected us by building a shield. Now, as anniversaries roll around, our bodies let down the shield because, perhaps, it is law that we have to walk through it? The only way through is through. Maybe our bodies/minds know this and know we haven't actually walked through, yet. As painful as it is, the mind and body know our capacity to survive even though we are screaming "NO". Maybe we aren't supposed to get it out of our minds right now. Maybe it's more painful because we resist the pain. Maybe surrendering to the pain and allowing it to fill us with the deep sorrow of loss will make it easier? Kind of like breathing through contractions.

I don't think we'll be grateful for this experience until we join our children. Then, I hope, we will have full knowledge and be able to understand the reasons behind all this. The hope in the hereafter, in a bigger meaning, in pure love and light. Then, we can be grateful for every step of the way.

Maybe I'm full of ca ca too. Like I said, just a thought.

[ericasmom]

Rhonda Sweetie, it makes perfect sense to me and I dare say, everyone here that going to the church today might be too much and you should free yourself from this feeling of having to go. God and Westley understand your heart, it does not have to be at church to be devoted. Let yourself stay home and let the tears come when they do. Feeling alone, I get, and although we have one another, we are at times very alone with the loss that has us undone. Being alone with it, as dark as it feels sometimes, is the thing you need to allow. As far as feeling a failure, that all you have done led you to this sadness, well, no, all you did led to a great deal of joy for all th efolks that love you, and for all the folks that have been living a good life in part due to you. Understand taht the dates will always be a sharp ache, they still are for me too, and I imagine always will be. I do not plan anything still on the dates July 8-July18, as Eri was hit on the 8th, she died on the 14th, and her funeral was on the 18th, at the church we attended when my Kids were young. So many out-of-state writing workshops occur on those July weeks and I still cannot bring myself to sign up for them as I am unsure how I will be if I am not near the cemetery adn home. Everyone to their own beat adn rhythm Rhonda, no rules, and sometimes that is the kick isn't it, if someone could just tell me the damn rules of this whole thing. There are none, we are left to drigt like so many snowflakes finding our shape anew through the days and weeks that follow and those will become months and y ears, and one day during this strange process, you will feel lighter, you will feel encouraged from within, and this I promise.

[Guest msnher]

Karen - are you okay this morning?

[ericasmom]

Hi All, went for a walk this morning, went to the grocery store after that, came home and husband is back from detroit where he was for a wedding this weekend. He drove with his elderly uncle and went to his cousin's wedding. I did not feel up to the trip having had the surgery adn not fully bendable. I also wanted to stay here to be with Carol when she came in from Massachusetts. She is on her return trip now. I was watching the Bears with husband, but he injury I saw take place on the Seahawks team just unnerved me.

Sometimes I just can't watch. Hope he is okay.

How quiet it is today, outside, here, it is a hushed day.

[kmb22]

Edit

[daveydow1]

Karen----Oh, dear friend......I'm so sorry about all the difficulty with your son, and the rest of the family. You sound like a real

peacemaker, and try your best to bring about harmony in the family. But, sometimes, try as we may......we can't fix all the

different hates, jealouy, and mean pettiness that we run into in this world. Your heart is broken, and you may feel especially

vulnerable to this kind of mean spiritedness around you. It must hurt that you are experiencing this, knowing that dear Shawn,

too, would not like the troubles in your family. My son, David, was also one who was a gentle person who disliked people

being mean to each other. I just send prayers that you can find some peace. My heart is with you.

Dee-----Such a nice birthday gathering for Betty's 90th birthday. I bet she really enjoyed it. Also, nice that you and Carol had a

chance to get together to have a meal and catch up. Sorry that her husband is in a nursing home suffering from Parkinson's

disease. My friend, Carol, is also in that same position. Her companion is also in a nursing home and has Parkinson's, along

with COPD. I still have lingering symptoms from the flu (tiredness, cold-like symptoms), but I keep on going. You know how

it is--------one can't stay home indefinitely. . Your winter walks sound nice. Our view out the back window is a nice one---

Blue sky with wispy clouds, dark tree branches, red outbuildings & barn, and fields blanketed in white.

Rhonda-----I'm sorry you are feeling so down, but it is completely understandable. As Dee & Susannah said,......you may decide that going to

the church is too difficult for you; and that you don't have to be in the church to be devoted and full of love for your dear West. In

your dream, Westley was surely giving you the message that he is OK, and that he loves you too. I also had a dream of Dave

the other night., when he was of another age......about 10 or 11. In the dream, he was to go with a friend on some sort of outing.

The friend's father was a Dr. The Dr. was in another room talking to someone else, and did not see me sitting in some sort of

waiting room. I overheard him tell the other person that he did not think that my son was good enough for his son, and that he

wanted to have my son excluded from the outing. Then he came out to where I was sitting, and I proceeded to tell him that my

son was a good person, and that his son & my son were friends, and that i didn't want my son to be hurt. (I was more or less setting him straight in a calm, but assertive way). That was all there was too it. Dave was just somehow in the 'shadows' of the dream. I do sometimes wonder why we have these dreams where our child is some other age....., but I think we are always glad to have the dream. My husband had a

dream not too long ago about Lisa (our baby who died at 6 mo. of age----many years ago). In his dream, she was a grown young

woman. Just please take care of yourself, Rhonda. Peace & comfort to you, friend.

Davey&Lisasmom, Sherry

[daveydow1]

View out out back window.

Sherry

[daveydow1]

trying again.

Sorry----I'll have to try some other time.

[ericasmom]

Funny Sherry, I never load photos the same way twice...why? Cause I cannot remember how i did it each time. I bet though that the view is beautiful, a serene view of prairie under snow. I do hope that you are feeling much better soon. I bought soup fixings and I will make it tomorrow since we are off for Martin Luther King Jr. Birthday. I have to go see the surgeon in the morning and see if all is fine.

Yes Karen, I do visit from time to time. Less so lately in part because I am THE BIGGEST CHICKEN I have ever met. I hate to fly, hate it. I do take medicine because I get extremely motion sick, but the meds don't always work, especially if the flight is turbulent. But even more than that is my fear of flying. Unfortunately, I passed this fear to my Son, th etwo of us are CHICKENS. Since Eri died, we both got worse with things like that. I used to fly way more often, now, I don't mind if I never fly again. Funny, when Erz was dying, Jon and I both told folks that there is nothing to be afraid of now, we know that there will be someone waiting for us...but it is the thought that I am JOn's only remaining family member, you know, immediate family, that I feel extra scared of things. Crazy hu?

But the last time we were in Plymouth, Jonathan and i flew with my husband and his girlfriend and we attended his cousin Pete's wedding. I love the area. When I was married the first time, to Jon and Eri's dad, Mike, we went to the cape for our honeymoon. We loved it. Later in lives, Carol and her husband moved to Cohassett and we went there several times. Now she lives in Plymouth. I do love the east coast very much.

I sure hope that some sort of peaceful measures come from your group coming over tonight. I will send good energy your way Dear.

[rlolheiser]

not much going on here, I have a cold that is knocking me down on my bottom... I am trying to take care of mom and keep my distance, that is tough to do... I don't feel up to much.. just thought I would say hi and hugs to all..

[summergirl]

Dee - "I feel the extra scared of things" - wow, I know that feeling...I have always been afraid of flying and take meds to get me through it. It is not the fear of flying and dying - it is the fear of leaving Tavian behind, that I cannot fathom - that is the only fear I have now. I will tell Tavian that you are glad about him loving birds and nature....he loves all animals and would have one of every kind if we let him.

Karen - I am so sorry for all that you are dealing with, the loss of your son, your other son not connecting, the family - I understand about your other son and although I do not know the reason behind him moving out or the messes you bailed him out of I do understand as I have a son that caused me heartache for many years due to a drug addiction, it was pure hell on the family and did not improve when we lost Jessica, in fact he got worse from the pain he was dealing with....it has taken 4 years since Jess left for him to finally find his way and I pray each night that he continues to live the good life he now has. I too am a FIXER and unfortunatley have found out the hard way that you cannot fix anyone but yourself, trying to fix everyone just leaves you drained, empty and sad and we already have enough of that in our lives. I have found, as hard as it is, that it is ok to step back from all of those who are causing so much turmoil in your life, let them go for a while and just take care of you...if they love you they will understand and if they do not understand then too bad because right now it is about you and what you need. I know that sounds cruel maybe but you really do need to concentrate on yourself and your grief and you cannot do that if you are trying to fix everyone else. I am sorry if I have hurt your feelings....I don't mean to, it is just that I have been there...Prayers

Quite a time with Tavian tonight...he was at Damien's for a sleep over and came home tonight with Damien as they both have no school tomorrow and I do not work but Damien's mom has to work. Anyway, he was in total melt down mode, yelling, screaming, throwing things, saying "I hate my life"....I did everything I could do to get him to calm down and talk to me but no matter what I said he was having no part of it...it finally got to the point where I had to walk away from him. It took about an hour before he was at the point where Barry could finally talk to him and calmed him down. It has been a long time since this happened and I hate it, it scares me and leaves me wondering "why" ?? I think part of me understands "why" but it is not something I can actually define so I am definetly talking him back to therapy, he needs it so I am calling tomorrow and set up an appointment. Hopefully it will help us both.

Yes, we are pretty settled in the house now. I am taking my time with things such as pictures that I want to hang on the walls etc. I do not want to rush it just to get it done. I have some beautiful frames that I know where I want but have not decided on the pics for them yet. My next project is Tavian's playroom, am going up Island to IKEA and see what they have, it is a great place and I could spend hours there and probably will....

Well, boys are settled down watching tv so I will read for a bit before bed. Peace, strength and love, Kathy

Love this pic of Barry and Tavian...

[mikesmomrs]

a fairly quiet day on the board today, it seems.

Leah: Take care as best you can...you don't want to come down with anything, I am sure. Using hand sanitizer is a good idea...frequently. Good luck!

Rhonda: I do also send out my understanding of how you are feeling...and I agree with the others who have commented...there are no rules...we have to do what we feel we have to do, and if that involves your NOT going to church today, then I hope you were able to allow yourself that choice. When we moved to Dover, 2 years after Mike died, we had to drive by his church (Mike belonged to the Evangelical church and we belonged to the Catholic church....the Evengelical church is where his service was) and just driving by was very difficult. If he had his services at our church, I don't know how long it would have taken me to allow myself to go back in there. Of course, Mike was not present at his services, as he chose to be cremated. We had a picture done and placed at the entrance to the church. My main point is that it was difficult for me to just drive by the church where we saw him last, last kissed his cheek. It was about 2-3 weeks before he was confined to bed; we all went to his church that Sunday, just so we could all go to church together. In our own church, we have attended for over 20 years, we have a particular area where we always sit. It was very rough the first few times I went after Mike died...I could feel him sitting beside me, and in actuality, it had been a very long time since he'd been there beside me. It is not unusual, either, for you to not really know what you've done for the past year. I think we are in a state of shock most of that time. As for not having done the "right" things in the past...many feet have trod that path, many times over, and I for one can tell you, there are no answers at the end of that path. Just more questions. More doubts. More guilt. It has been hard, but like others, I've had to learn to pull myself away from that path of thinking...you have to pull yourself away and then start walking through this grief again...many others have said, and it is so true, "the only way through this grief, is through it." The journey is tough, twisty, laden with pitfalls along the way, and that is why it is good to have people to turn to, to talk to, to help you. That is why, I believe, that our angels led us to each other...they knew we needed each other. sending you love and strength and comfort...I know that even with all of these comforting wishes, there are still times when we feel so alone on this journey. That is when, I think, that we need to let the tears flow, let ourselves grieve. It is important, it is moving "through" and it is healing, eventually. Not "healing" as in "all better." It will never be "all better." But healing as in we are able to function again...and there is no time set for this...each one is on an individual "clock." Just please know that we are all here for you, always. I do like it that Westley came to your dream to let you know that he knows you love him.

Karen: I am so sorry also that you are having so much "family trouble." You are having to deal with enough..."he said-she said" is something that I have always tried to keep out of our lives...it is not always possible, as you well know. I wish you strength to handle it, to keep it out of your life, as much as possible. I hope you have a good "get together" with your niece and the boys tonight. Perhaps the sharing will bring comfort to all of you.

Dee: I am glad that you got to visit with Carol, and also for the birthday party for Betty. I am with you on the scaredy cat thing about flying. As you know. I am supposed to fly to Florida in the spring to visit my sister and SIL again, like I did year before last. I guess I'll just have to "suck it up" as I don't want to disappoint them. One thing I won't do, though, is fly in the winter. If I got on a plane and heard the words "We have to deice the wings" I am OUTTA there!

Bonnie: It was so good to see Jason's sunshine-filled face again! I am sorry about the legal hassles storming you again...are they the same as before? Not that it matters...the stress is still there. I wonder if we haven't heard from Lorri and Betsy because they haven't been able to get on the site, as you haven't...

I didn't get to go tubing with the kids this weekend...Saturday was too cold, and though Sunday was warmer (29 instead of 19), it was windy, so the wind chill was too low. Maybe next weekend. I did get to play with Damon in the snow in our yard, so I will have to be happy with that for now.

Trudi and Betsy: Holding you both close, keeping you in my prayers and thoughts.

love and peace, carol mikesmomrs

[mikesmomrs]

Kathy: I guess we posted at the same time. AFter reading your post, I thought I would add a thought or two to you. Of course, Tavian has different reasons that may be impacting his behavior, but I just wanted to share about our Jamie (Cathi's youngest, 12, but a very young 12). Sometimes when he has a friend over, or most often, his cousin Kameron is over and spends one or two nights on the weekend, things can get out of hand, especially those times when Jamie is at another house instead of having the guest at his house. Sometimes other's view of discipline is "boys will be boys" especially when they get together and people think "let them play" it's good for them, and don't step in to calm things down when necessary. Jamie gets so out of sorts when this happens...I think it is that he needs to knwo that "someone is in charge" and when that is not evident, he tends to lose control. I don't know, of course, if this is what happens to Tav, but I guess it would be worth considering. Also, Cathi has found out that sometimes there is no set bedtime, and they are allowed to stay up til "whenever," so that is something she has had to make sure does not happen. Anyway, just thought I would add my two cents, for whatever it's worth. I love the picture of Tavian and Barry...they both look so good! So glad that you are feeling "settled" in your new home...we still don't have pics up! A spring project for sure, for me.

love and peace,

carol mikesmomrs

[mikesmomrs]

Just wanted to let you all knwo that I spoke to Lorri through email, and she is okay...her laptop is in the shop til next week. She si going to speak next week to a biker group that helped raise funds for Kourtney's Kloset last year, and she is very nervous. I told her to pretend she was talking to Kourtney, and not to worry about tears coming...it would be unusual if they didn't. She asked that you all pray for her to be able to get through it.

love and peace, carol mikesmomrs

[ericasmom]

Carol, thanks for the Lorri update. How cool for her to speak to the group of bikers who raised funds. I bet that they make her an official member of their team. She may be nervous, but I have a feeling that she will not only pull it off, but add her funny as heck sense of humor. Good for her.

As for your speaking about Jamie and connecting to Tavian, I was thinking the same thing, if the boys were left to their own devices and Tav is overtired, it is likely he will go off like that. I do still think the therapist is a great idea. For Tav to yell out that he hates his life is a definite "help-me" moment.

Carol, I love the advice you give so gently , it sprinkles from your ever-loving heart. Yes, you and Kathy and me are scardy-cats but what the heck, hard one to change.

Leah, drink a lot of water and juice, you must rest, and you must sleep more to get healthy again. I know it sounds impossible, but necessary.

I must get some rest now, I hope we all rest well, deeply, and dream if at all, sweetly.

Love to you each

[mikesmomrs]

MICHEAL...MICHEAL...MICHEAL...saying his name, always remembering...holding you close. He is with you always, surrounding you in memories, bittersweet, and yet so welcomed.

love and peace to you, Trudi, my friend. I know that it is already the 18th where you are...keeping you close in my heart, thoughts and prayers.

carol mikesmomrs

[rlolheiser]

Just in for a minute.. can't breathe much today... just feels stuffed.. Thanks for the advice Carol and Dee. I will try to follow.. but there just isn't a lot of rest around here.. not til night time... Prayers for all

Thinking of Micheal, thinking of Trudi and her family so lonely without Micheal.. May they feel him all around them as they go through today and everyday.

Micheal MICHEAL Micheal

[Bensmummy]

Hello ..every single one of you..xxxooo Ive been really busy working and making stacks of dreadlocks for a market next week. I had taken some to a market a couple of weeks ago just to show off what I teach in my childrens craft classes and everyone kept wanting to buy them...Thank you ERICA xxoo :-) So my husband and I and the kids locked the gate and we sat around the sink and got covered in soapy water and made lots and lots of dreads out of gorgeous dyed merino wool. I made them big stuffed potatoes and it looks like they are going to be regular on the menu..havent made them for years...A really good day...

Today I saw the doctor and he went through the autopsy report with me on Ben....Wow! is that full on or what. Its not like the coroners report its way more deeper than that and I know some would not like to do this but I had too...you see the coroners report said that he died from multiple injuries..I needed to see in black and white that he did not know he was dying from multiple injuries and I dam sure didnt want him to feel it either..I got my answer in black and white...I also learnt the weight of his brain and his kidneys..it made me smile..ok dont worry Im not been a freak here...for me this is special..I nourished ..grew that brain..he was a part of me and I dont have that left anymore I dont get to see him grow anymore at this time.

He instantly died what a huge relief and it all happened at once he actually received injuries that cannot sustain life anyway. Four things happened at the one time to his precious body that took him without pain or suffering..Im also very blessed that I had a beautiful face to look upon and say goodbye...His helmet gave him that much protection. I was also cross and so was our family doctor...he had a perfect healthy body..all in all he was in excellent health and fitness and yet no regard for the sanctity and the fragility of life. He rode at what they call break neck speed and break neck is exactly what happened. Why do these children not realize how precious life is...GGGRRRRRRRRR!!!!!!!!

I will add that seem to handle it really well..the doctor took my blood pressure after and it was perfect..LoL later this afternoon..I had an overwhelming tiredness come over me and a slight headache so I went and laid down. this happened when it was his birth time the other day I got the same reaction...I can see a real pattern forming with me...Interesting, does anyone else get this or some other similar type reaction..sometimes a little bit after and at the time seem really cool and okay. After the sleep Im okay again now ..I processed the information and now its ok done is done ...cant change a thing so accept be grateful for the small mercies..no pain no consciousness..face to talk too and shower with kisses...and now he is so very SAFE! hugs Michelle xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxoooooooooooooooooooooo share them around good people :-)

[hotrod]

MICHEAL, MICHEAL, MICHEAL

SAYING YOUR NAME AND REMEMBERING YOUR GENTLE HEART

PLEASE TOUCH MOM TODAY WITH YOUR WARMTH AND LOVE

[shorty16]

Ben's Mum

I too read the coroners report - in depth - from one end to the other. I was hard, but I had to know. Brian did not died immediately, but within minutes. Nothing wrong with his brain or head at all - blunt-force trama to the chest and abdomen (sorry for the horrible spelling).

One of Brian's friends stopped by last night - it was wonderful. Takes a while to get used to these visits - They are growing up and Brian is frozen in time. But after a while, the visits are very welcome.

Anyway, Tom told me the past 3 weeks he has had visits from Brian. Brian would be sitting there right next to him or in the room with him. This boy, Tom is also the one who said Brian came to him the night he was killed. Brian did not say anything, but was all dressed in white and was zooming around the room with the biggest smile on his face.

Tom seemed a bit shaken by the visits and I told Tom that he was special and for some reason, Brian has choosen him. I asked him to stop over anytime he needed to talk about this.

Really Cool - My Boy is in his energy form and visiting his friends.

Colleen, Brian's Mother Forever

[shorty16]

Green Bay Packers at Chicago Bears

This has not happened since 1941.

89 years of FRIENDLY rivaly between these two teams.

I wish the Bear fans a safe and fun game this Sunday

Colleen, Brian's Mother Forever

PS: I am wearing my Emerald ring all week!!!!

[Bensmummy]

Brians Mum....hello. Yes it is tuff to read but know this apparently when the body has such a shock the adrenalin kicks in and there is no pain. I hope you understand this...but how difficult it must have been. I have a young man who also was close to Ben and he often calls me up sometimes even late at night and talks to me about Ben...He made me laugh as those two were a couple of little devils together and I was always having to tell them off. He said I know Ben didnt listen to you but I did and Im glad you told us off as Ben would have got us into alot of trouble ..or a lot more trouble if you hadnt been watching out for us...hahahhahhaha...its all Bens fault and he Fritz is his name had little to do with it...yeah right lol.!!! this kid always gave me the big brown eyed Im so innocent look...he turned out good though really smart and he did tell me he had to stop hanging out with Ben because Ben was mixing with a wild bunch and he had a wife and child and couldnt get involved with this...fair enough too. When he heard what happened he came up to the hospital just as I was spending some time with Ben..the first words he said when he saw me is...and he looked terrible shocked...he asked me "Ben didnt feel anything did he, there wasnt any pain was there??" I said no and allowed him to speak to Ben say goodbye...I left him in the room but I could hear him saying his goodbyes....now that was terrible hard and yet beautiful at the same time....yes the friends they leave behind can be so healing for us mums. Michelle

[Guest msnher]

MICHEAL MICHEAL MICHEAL MICHEAL MICHEAL MICHEAL MICHEAL

[kmb22]

Micheal...Micheal...Micheal....Please shine your light down and show your Mum you're always with her. Trudi holding you close in thoughts and prayer. {HUGS}

[westleysmom]

Micheal Shane, Always loved and missed

Trudi-Holding you close in my thoughts this day.

[Guest msnher]

"Stephanie's dead." It was a quiet voice, louder than a whisper. My eyes shot open from my deep sleep feeling as if I had been slugged in the gut. I lay there, getting my barings, the two words I had just heard echoing over and over again. My husband's restful breathing pulled me into the NOW. I can't say it pulled me into reality....I was in reality. She's dead.

[ericasmom]

MICHEAL,

In you the ocean moves and the tides whisper your name over and over to your Mum. Your Sweet Mum. Cast your wide love, your whole love over the Family touching each with the dreams that filled your spirit, allowing them the visions of beauty all around them.

Trudi, may you feel the gentle touch and the encompassing love of your Sweet SON.

[Bensmummy]

"Stephanie's dead." It was a quiet voice, louder than a whisper. My eyes shot open from my deep sleep feeling as if I had been slugged in the gut. I lay there, getting my barings, the two words I had just heard echoing over and over again. My husband's restful breathing pulled me into the NOW. I can't say it pulled me into reality....I was in reality. She's dead.

I know this dream...I had it too..and I woke the whole family with my loud howling as I came out of the dream into the reality of a nightmare...hugs and hugs...I felt my heart contract when I read your words..You are not alone. Our children are dead but I say asleep in death till we are reunited with them again...for now they are so very safe and feeling nothing at all..only we here feel but if we can just trust in the peace and the promise that our creator gives us ...then just maybe the dream will go away and be replaced by anticipation of the reunion that will surely come. Michelle

[Bensmummy]

Trudi ...I am thinking of you here so close in Aussie land but not close enough to hug for real...sending my thoughts and the good old back slapping how ya going and come here and have a hug! to you right now...though unlike me I think you might be sleeping. Awake in the peace of knowing Micheal is safe. Michelle