After death

[Carolyn h]

My partner and I were only together for a couple years but we are very close and we definitely loved each other. He passed last month. I've learned now that he never got over his ex. Is that who he'll be waiting for in that afterlife? seems like a silly question but I guess that's what's on my mind tonight. Maybe because I try and find peace in the fact that maybe I will see him again. I don't know because I really don't know how it works. I do know though that I feel rather embarrassed for this even being an issue. I hate this journey.. I truly do. Maybe someone else has gone to this.

[KayC]

Please don't feel embarrassed, our feelings are valid, all of them, even when sometimes we feel two things at once, contrary to each other!  There are legitimate reasons for them.

I don't know your beliefs, all I know is the Bible (Christian) and it says there is no marriage in heaven so I reckon things will be different.  I think we'll carry our memories and know each other, that we'll be together again, but no jealousy or other hurt in heaven.  It'll be perfection.  It's hard for our finite minds to grasp it because we haven't seen anything like it here!  I do trust God and His decisions and so I don't worry about it but rather know whatever He has for us will be good and better than here...that is hard to conceive of because here with George was the best thing I've ever known!  

I know some do not believe in the afterlife, this is not to sway them whatsoever, but rather a response to your question as best as I know. 

 

[BBB]

Hard to say, hard to imagine how it will be. As Kay said, the bible says there are no husbands and wives, no marriage. So from an earthly perspective, it is kind of hard to imagine exactly how things will be. I would assume that we will see them again but it's weird to think that we won't look at them as spouses. 

 

[Carolyn h]

Thank you. Both of those responses helped. I don't really know what I believe in. But I do feel a little better about it today and I did last night. Every day is different I guess but the same as well without him. Thanks again. I truly appreciate it

[SDC]

Please don't be embarrassed. Grief brings up endless questions and seeking. Humans have sought the answers to questions like you posed for centuries. I think we all project our human experience on our perception of the afterlife. How could we not? It's all we know. But I don't believe the afterlife includes things like a soul waiting for loved person 1 more intensely than loved person 2---that's a kind of qualifying thought we have in life that helps us define who are to someone and I don't think comparisons/defining/etc exist beyond our human brains. I think most of us agree that love is the best human experience. I like to think the afterlife is all the love we experienced in life expanding in ways we can't imagine--and that will, of course, include our profound, most loved person being with us in a way beyond our brain's comprehension. 

[LovingHerForever]

https://leewoof.org/2017/01/12/didnt-jesus-say-theres-no-marriage-in-heaven/

(https://leewoof.org/2017/01/29/will-happily-married-couples-be-together-in-heaven/)

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=9gdngWOvKas&feature=youtu.be&t=492

https://swedenborg.com/married-couples-in-the-afterlife/

http://www.swedenborgstudy.com/articles/marriage/fls67.htm

 

 

[BBB]

Below is exactly what the bible says when asked about multiple wives, so really it is open to your own interpretation. Jesus does not come out and say in plain english 'there is no marriage in heaven' but what does 'they neither marry nor are given in marriage' mean?

 

For when they rise from the dead, they neither marry nor are given in marriage, but are like angels in heaven

 

To further confuse the issue, Romans says this - For a married woman is bound by law to her husband while he lives, but if her husband dies she is released from the law of marriage

[Gail 8588]

I don't know what lies ahead any more than you. But I do think love is an extraordinary power. 

For me, the birth of my second child was an enlightening experience.

Like many parents, we felt our first child was the most magnificent creature that ever lived. The sun and the moon revolved in their orbits for him. I didn't know how we would ever be able to love another child as much.

Then our second child was born and miraculously our hearts overflowed with love for him as well.  It was amazing. We didn't love our first born any less and we loved this second being just as much.

I think heaven may be like that. 

Gail

[Carolyn h]

I like that. Thanks. I'm just so lost. I don't want to do this anymore. 

 

[jmmosley53]

As a kid I was upset because of the death of our dog, and I was told by neighbor kids that dogs can't go to heaven.  My Mom told me that heaven was paradise.  She also said how could it be paradise for me if the dog wasn't there?  So I'm thinking it will be however it needs to be for you to be happy.

[Roxeanne]

I think it too jmmo...what kind of paradise would be without our loving pets ?

[foreverhis]

16 hours ago, Carolyn h said:

I do know though that I feel rather embarrassed for this even being an issue.

Welcome.  I'm sorry you find yourself here with us, but it's a good place to be.  Please don't feel embarrassed by any questions or feelings or thoughts you have.  Believe me, we've either had them ourselves or talked about it with others who do.  In fact, I'm remembering a recent thread about spirituality and "Is there an afterlife?  If there is, what happens with our beloveds?"  I can't quite recall, but I think one of the concerns was about people remarrying or having a new relationship.

My personal feeling is that love always multiplies and is infinite.  I believe he will be waiting for you both because one love does not diminish the other.

1 hour ago, jmmosley53 said:

As a kid I was upset because of the death of our dog, and I was told by neighbor kids that dogs can't go to heaven.  My Mom told me that heaven was paradise.  She also said how could it be paradise for me if the dog wasn't there?  So I'm thinking it will be however it needs to be for you to be happy.

This is what I believe with all my heart.  I know that when it's my time, it won't just be John waiting for me.

[Mark loves Sandra]

@Carolyn h

Carolyn,

As everyone has said, don't be embarrassed -- your feelings are all valid -- even the bizarre ones (see my thread about Sandra ["Lost love of my life . . ." ] to read my irrational thoughts).  Geez, and having said that, I have some direct experience with what you're describing -- but am too embarrassed to write about it.  Feel free to message me directly if you'd like some support on this.

As for what happens when we die, the unfortunate fact is simply that no one knows -- not me, not a minister, not my neighbor, not the pope.  We each have our beliefs and that's our prerogative.  What you choose to believe is very personal and special to you, so don't let anyone tell you you're wrong, because that person doesn't know either.

At any rate, each person on here understands your pain (I wish I didn't), so the sympathy they offer is genuine.  I'm sorry for your loss and mine.  I don't know how to go on either.

--Mark

[KayC]

My grief counselor/mentor/friend sent me that cartoon when my Arlie died, I've shared it many times because it's not only cute but I believe it to be true!  I love all of your answers here, as we try to make some sense out of things with our finite minds.  I do not worry about what is to come, but more getting through right now because frankly, life here is hard and I believe whatever is to come will be better than this.  

Mark, none of us here are telling anyone what to believe, just sharing our perspectives and trying to help each other through this.

[Mark loves Sandra]

57 minutes ago, KayC said:

Mark, none of us here are telling anyone what to believe, just sharing our perspectives and trying to help each other through this.

Kay,

I know.  I have to be careful what I write on this subject because among the many untamed emotions bouncing around in my head is the "angry-at-God" line of thinking.  I'm not a religious person, but accept that there is much we don't know.  However, if a higher power does exist, I'm very upset with how this operation is being run.  As @Perro J said last year shortly after his newly-found love-of-his-life succumbed quickly to stomach cancer, "Not just upset, but "F*** you and what was the point of all that to have us find love and contentment with one another only to take it away too soon and take away a wonderful human being from this planet when it seems to be chock full of plenty of other candidates that the world would be a better place without!" angry at God. 

At any rate, I genuinely hope you and @foreverhis (and others) are right.

And Carolyn, you and your partner loved each other, and that's what's really important.  I have very mixed up feelings just like you, but Sandra and I loved each other with our whole beings, so that has to be enough for now.  

--Mark

[KayC]

Oh Mark, I understand, my heart goes out to you.  I remember that early grief well, it's normal to feel angry at God, even if you don't believe in Him!  We go through so much in our early grief, it's the biggest trauma I've ever gone through.  His death was unexpected, premature, sudden.  It was the third day of his hospital stay and even with a team of the best cardiologists, they could do nothing to stave off his death.  I felt gypped and it was very hard to see couples that still get to have each other when we were soulmates and loved each other so completely, were so happy together!  I found no "answers" and I hate cliches, they don't help, if anything they can be very hurtful.  People said the most stupid things to me!  Friends all disappeared overnight!  I would never do that to someone!  It sure has a way of rewriting our address book and discovering who our friends are...or aren't.  But I've also discovered caring people in unlikely places.  Life has been a struggle since then, loss of jobs, recessions, surgeries alone, dealing with home repairs, finances, etc...all alone.  It took me years to build a life I could live and then Covid came along and destroyed it overnight.  Back to square one.  But I've learned a tremendous amount in these years since his death, I've learned a lot about myself, that I'm stronger than I ever could have imagined (and it doesn't seem to play in that we don't always FEEL strong)!  I am a survivor.  You will be too, even if you can't see it now, I can tell by your attitudes and and what you write.  You will be okay...not great in the sense before was, that's gone, all but our memories and what we learned from them and the good we shared, those are ours forever and no one can take them away, not even dementia.  I saw that in my mom...she had stave IV dementia and I remember her telling me she "used to have a husband, she wondered what happened to him, they must have divorced or something."  I told her, "Mom, you never would have divorced, daddy's been gone 32 years, but he's waiting for you in heaven, you had quite a love story and it's never ended."  She teared up but it brought her comfort/joy to be reassured of it.  The dementia care facility took his portrait off her wall and when I asked why they said "she cries every time she sees it."  I'm of the opinion that crying isn't the worst thing, not feeling anything is.  I disagreed with them.

BTW, I think this is a good article don't be off-put by the title, it's not about the 5 stages (which was not written for death) but explains well what we feel and what we can do to help ourselves.
https://www.griefhealingblog.com/2012/01/is-anger-one-of-stages-of-grief.html

[BBB]

I feel angry at God Mark and many people tell me all the time that God did not take away my soulmate. I think it's 6 of one, half dozen of the other and I know we'll all have differing opinions here. My opinion, which some people will understand and others will totally disagree with is this - I prayed, I wanted my wife to beat cancer. She died way too young and I never got to even spend day one in retirement with her. All future plans for that, down the toilet. I asked God to save her, spare her and he did not. For this I am angry. 

 

[KayC]

And I get that.

[widower2]

On 2/9/2021 at 12:06 AM, Carolyn h said:

My partner and I were only together for a couple years but we are very close and we definitely loved each other. He passed last month. I've learned now that he never got over his ex. Is that who he'll be waiting for in that afterlife? seems like a silly question but I guess that's what's on my mind tonight. Maybe because I try and find peace in the fact that maybe I will see him again. I don't know because I really don't know how it works. I do know though that I feel rather embarrassed for this even being an issue. I hate this journey.. I truly do. Maybe someone else has gone to this.

As others have said, and I agree, while I don't pretend to "know" how it works out there, I don't think there is marriage in any real sense and there's no having or even wanting to choose one person over another. You had a relationship with him that was as special and unique as each of you are...that will still be there I think, but minus Earthly constraints of marriage. I kind of look at it this way, at least it seems most logical to me: in this life, with marriage you're sort of this self-contained unit of two, isolated in a way from everyone else. But out there, it's one huge wide-open plain...nobody is isolated from anyone else. There's no competing for someone's attention or love; it's not necessary. 

Definitely not a silly or embarrassing question, a very valid one I'm sure many have asked. In fact, someone was on this site a few years back who said he didn't want to ever get into another relationship because he was worried about some kind of conflict of who he would end up in Heaven with. I tried to talk him out of that mindset, but I don't know if I got through. I'd hate to think he forced himself to be alone for the rest of his life due to that. 

[borbzgirl]

Hi Carolyn, I hope you don't mind me asking but why do you think or how do you know that he never got over his ex? Thanks.

 

(I won't comment on the after-life subject because I don't believe in one.)

[KayC]

I want to mention that even if it's true he still had feelings for an ex, it doesn't take away from what the two of you had.  Sometimes we can have mixed feelings about an ex because there were good parts as well as the bad, and if you've spent a long time with someone, it's natural you develop some feelings.  But that does not mean he did not choose YOU and want to be with YOU!  I'm sure his feelings were also just as strong if not stronger for his CURRENT LOVE!  I wish he were here for you to talk this over with, it's so much harder to deal with unresolved issues after they're gone, but it can be done.  It helps to accept the whole of the person and realize that humans can be complex.  Remember each and every good moment you had together.  No one can take that away from you, not even death.

[MissyLaLaLa]

Carolyn H I have been looking into alot of Life after Life and Life after Death. It has given me comfort in believing that after I die I will be with my husband again, but that thought has also crossed my mind. The thought of what if I am not his soul mate. I just think about the love I have for him and the pain I feel. I still believe we will meet again one day I have to hold on to that belief it's the only thing that gives me comfort.

 

Mark I totally understand your emotions. I been going through anger as well not so much for me, but for my son. (I do believe in a God of my understanding) I got so upset that I was screaming "Why would God take a Father away from his son". People keep telling me God had something more important planned out for him, but in my mind I can't think of anything more important than our son. So I totally understand that anger.

 

 

[Diane R. E.]

It's my belief that God does not willingly "take" away someone's life here on earth. I feel that bad things happen for no reason because we live in an imperfect world and no human being is perfect. However, I believe that once someone has lost their physical presence here on earth, that's when God brings them home, and that is what comforts me. I do understand the anger though, of which I have felt plenty of times!

[BBB]

Might be nit picky but semantics can play a part in this. Some people don't like when others say God "took" someone. I prefer saying that God "allowed" that person to pass. Again, semantics but some people have a problem challenging God or questioning God or saying that he takes people from this world. 

[KayC]

10 hours ago, MissyLaLaLa said:

People keep telling me God had something more important planned out for him, but in my mind I can't think of anything more important than our son.

People say stupid cliches that don't know Jack, sorry don't know how else to put it!  Because they want to "make you feel better" or feel they have to say something, they fill it with their verbiage that would be better off left unsaid.  Again, how I feel.  Our society is just so uneducated when it comes to loss/grief!

There's no way we can understand the mind of God as we're not Him...we have finite minds that cannot see the whole picture, the future, really, not much.  Your anger, all our anger, it's valid, as all of our feelings are, it is what it is.  Nothing to feel ashamed for, we are human and believe me, I went through my own questioning (didn't get any answers) and anger.  I finally moved past it, as it did no good to ask why any more.  It was more of a "what now" I began asking myself.  I made mistakes, but somehow (I've been getting through this and have learned so much about myself over the years, and all of you have been my teachers about grief, enough to know I am not alone in it or in anything I experience.  I love you all.

[Mama]

My priest said one time, that when we die, God will meet you with his arms wide open and when he puts his arms down, all your love ones will be behind him waiting for you! I believe that.

[KayC]

@Mama thank you for that, that is very comforting.  Could you tell us a little about your story, when you are ready, of course.

I want to share an article I wrote of the things I've found helpful over the years, in the hopes something will be of help to you either now or on down the road.

TIPS TO MAKE YOUR WAY THROUGH GRIEF

There's no way to sum up how to go on in a simple easy answer, but I encourage you to read the other threads here, little by little you will learn how to make your way through this.  I do want to give you some pointers though, of some things I've learned on my journey.

• Take one day at a time.  The Bible says each day has enough trouble of it's own, I've found that to be true, so don't bite off more than you can chew.  It can be challenging enough just to tackle today.  I tell myself, I only have to get through today.  Then I get up tomorrow and do it all over again.  To think about the "rest of my life" invites anxiety.
• Don't be afraid, grief may not end but it evolves.  The intensity lessens eventually.
• Visit your doctor.  Tell them about your loss, any troubles sleeping, suicidal thoughts, anxiety attacks.  They need to know these things in order to help you through it...this is all part of grief.
• Suicidal thoughts are common in early grief.  If they're reoccurring, call a suicide hotline.  I felt that way early on, but then realized it wasn't that I wanted to die so much as I didn't want to go through what I'd have to face if I lived.  Back to taking a day at a time.  Suicide Hotline - Call 1-800-273-8255 or www.crisis textline.org or US and Canada: text 741741 UK: text 85258 | Ireland: text 50808
• Give yourself permission to smile.  It is not our grief that binds us to them, but our love, and that continues still.
• Try not to isolate too much.  
• There's a balance to reach between taking time to process our grief, and avoiding it...it's good to find that balance for yourself.  We can't keep so busy as to avoid our grief, it has a way of haunting us, finding us, and demanding we pay attention to it!  Some people set aside time every day to grieve.  I didn't have to, it searched and found me!
• Self-care is extremely important, more so than ever.  That person that would have cared for you is gone, now you're it...learn to be your own best friend, your own advocate, practice self-care.  You'll need it more than ever.
• Recognize that your doctor isn't trained in grief, find a professional grief counselor that is.  We need help finding ourselves through this maze of grief, knowing where to start, etc.  They have not only the knowledge, but the resources.
• In time, consider a grief support group.  If your friends have not been through it themselves, they may not understand what you're going through, it helps to find someone somewhere who DOES "get it". 
• Be patient, give yourself time.  There's no hurry or timetable about cleaning out belongings, etc.  They can wait, you can take a year, ten years, or never deal with it.  It's okay, it's what YOU are comfortable with that matters.  
• Know that what we are comfortable with may change from time to time.  That first couple of years I put his pictures up, took them down, up, down, depending on whether it made me feel better or worse.  Finally, they were up to stay.
• Consider a pet.  Not everyone is a pet fan, but I've found that my dog helps immensely.  It's someone to love, someone to come home to, someone happy to see me, someone that gives me a purpose...I have to come home and feed him.  Besides, they're known to relieve stress.  Well maybe not in the puppy stage when they're chewing up everything, but there's older ones to adopt if you don't relish that stage.
• Make yourself get out now and then.  You may not feel interest in anything, things that interested you before seem to feel flat now.  That's normal.  Push yourself out of your comfort zone just a wee bit now and then.  Eating out alone, going to a movie alone or church alone, all of these things are hard to do at first.  You may feel you flunked at it, cried throughout, that's okay, you did it, you tried, and eventually you get a little better at it.  If I waited until I had someone to do things with I'd be stuck at home a lot.
• Keep coming here.  We've been through it and we're all going through this together.
• Look for joy in every day.  It will be hard to find at first, but in practicing this, it will change your focus so you can embrace what IS rather than merely focusing on what ISN'T.  It teaches you to live in the present and appreciate fully.  You have lost your big joy in life, and all other small joys may seem insignificant in comparison, but rather than compare what used to be to what is, learn the ability to appreciate each and every small thing that comes your way...a rainbow, a phone call from a friend, unexpected money, a stranger smiling at you, whatever the small joy, embrace it.  It's an art that takes practice and is life changing if you continue it.
• Eventually consider volunteering.  It helps us when we're outward focused, it's a win/win.

(((hugs))) Praying for you today.

[BBB]

Thanks Kay. I hope I can make it to the day where I say what now instead of ask why

[KayC]

Itt can take a long time, and I think we only change it because we never got an answer to why.  Lord knows I asked!

[widower2]

On 2/16/2021 at 5:17 PM, Mama said:

My priest said one time, that when we die, God will meet you with his arms wide open and when he puts his arms down, all your love ones will be behind him waiting for you! I believe that.

Guess who I hope is at the front of the line?  

I have a basically deist take on what happens in life. God doesn't directly "make" things happen exactly, it's more like when he set things in motion in the beginning, it was like throwing a deck of cards in the air...he set things in motion, but from there, however they land, they land. However things play out, so be it. He wasn't going to interfere, even when the consequences were horrible, because to do so means it wouldn't really be LIFE...it would be him pulling our strings like puppets in a play, a hollow, fake imitation of life. 

So I'm sorry Mr Einstein, you're wrong: God does play dice. 

[Mama]

Thank you Kay C, for your reply, I really appreciate it. I will eventually tell our story when I'm get thru this a little more.

[KayC]

@Mama, Take your time, we're here, I'm not going anywhere.  (((hugs))))

[Carolyn h]

On 2/13/2021 at 7:00 PM, borbzgirl said:

Hi Carolyn, I hope you don't mind me asking but why do you think or how do you know that he never got over his ex? Thanks.

 

(I won't comment on the after-life subject because I don't believe in one.)

Hi I'm sorry it took awhile to get back. I've just been going through a lot. I know this because of a text I saw but I've also talked to somebody about it. the Tex from a long time ago and I did wind up giving him the comfort that he so needed. Really it was just one of those moments I was going through at the time. I hold fast to what we had and I know what we had and I know how he felt and that's good enough for me. I hate this journey though and I hate the waves. 

[Valerie Rose]

I'm absolutely convinced that we will see our loved ones after death.  I can feel my husband's presence all around. He is guiding and helping me all the time. 

[Carolyn h]

I think you just really have to hold on to what you had. You have to always know that he left you very much as well. It will always be yours and has to keep. This is what I believe now.