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      Hi all,  I'm sure you've noticed some changes in the forums. We've again had to do some updates, so that's why things may look a little different. Nothing major should have changed.  Also, we are going to start adding advertisements sensitive to our community on the boards. This is something we are experimenting with, and we will certainly make sure they are in the best interests of everyone. We want to make sure our forums continue to stay accessible and cost free to all of our members, and this is a way to ensure this.  If you have any questions or comments, please feel free to privately message me or email me at Konnie@beyondindigo.com.  As always, we will be here with you, ModKonnie
momofJustin

Loss of an Adult Child

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Goodness, Susan, so glad to see you post but certainly sorry for your illness. You were definitely missed and glad you are back and taking care of yourself.  If I remember from all of your pictures you are a slight woman so you cannot lose too much weight.  Hoping you get a good outcome and get back on your feet.  Positive thoughts and prayers go out to you.

Thanks Dee and Kate for positive thoughts for my cousin.  She and her husband went to the Medical Examiner's office yesterday and thankfully they were able to identify via a picture as opposed to actually seeing the body.   He has been dead since 11/19 and had no ID nor did he list any next of kin on his apartment lease. If not for his boss looking for him I am not sure how my cousin would have ever been tracked. Being the weekend, no one that was there was able to tell them anything. The morgue tech said maybe it was a homicide....MAYBE????  What a horrid thought to put in their heads and then have to go home and wait. Tim and I took them some food to their house yesterday and spent a little time with them.  We let them talk and talk which we know was good for them.  

My daughter is flying into Chicago tomorrow and we are picking her up from the airport to spend the afternoon.  She had to come in for work-her company is in Chicago but she works from home--I am looking so forward to seeing her.  Wish she could have brought my granddaughter but I know that wasn't possible.  I am happy to see her.

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SUSAN! I thought that perhaps the holidays were troubling for you and you went quiet, or that you too had the cold that so many of us had and were too pooped to hang out...I am so sorry that your health was the reason, but very happy to know that they are getting to the bottom of it all. A little polyp can cause a big problem. I am sure that your family is surrounding you with love and care and I look forward to the day in the not too far future where you can eat a hamburger again. It is good that you pay close attention to your body Susan, grateful for your being here too, being back home and being here at home with us. Nothing but healing, ya hear?

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Dianne, goodness knows that your cousin will need to let her story out, to talk and talk and God knows what a special cousin you are to her to be able to listen to the grief stories a this time, a time in your lives where anniversaries and pain is prevalent. Your Daughter coming in tomorrow is great timing and I wish you a beautiful time with her. Does your cousin live in my area? Is there anything I can do to assist her?

 

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Thanks, Dee, you are very kind but we have it covered for now.  She lives in Lansing so we are only about 7 miles apart. She is a very stoic person ( as opposed to me... I got all the emotion... the heart on my sleeve stuff). She was going to tell her mother this afternoon so I am kind of anxious about that. Her mother is 99 and in a nursing home and has essentially her faculties intact but is really not well.  I suggested she might not want to tell her as that is her only grandchild.  She said she had to tell her so it is her mom and she knows best.  I am sure my aunt would have picked up on something being wrong. She told me I look so sad last time I saw her.  So she has most of her mind but she is truly going down hill.  Hope that went ok.  Maybe going through the darkness I had from a couple of weeks ago just helped me rebound well enough to help my cousin... just focus on her pain and be there.  We are certainly at an age where we will lose loved ones but who could anticipate that both of our mothers lived (lives) into their 90's and both of us lose our sons.

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You and me both Dianne, all the emotion, tears at the ready all the time...24/7. I am a salt-lick.

Peaceful visit today

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dianne how awful for your cousin. To lose a child and not know because he was so reclusive is terribly sad my heart goes out to her. i am glad she has you to help her through this traumatic time. We all know the emotions and thoughts that surround a parent when they lose their child. At least he was found and can be interred and a service held in his memory for those he left behind. Sadly some people do prefer an isolated existence cutting themselves off from family and friends to live alone whether they have mental issues or not, but I am sure that was a source of great anxiety and sadness for your cousin over time. I am glad your daughter will be with you perhaps she can help to lift your spirits. We spend our lives preparing our children for the world and to fly the nest but it is hard when we cannot see them as often because they live in other cities. I kind of hanker for the good old days when all the family used to live in the same town and had more opportunity to gather together, but understand times have changed and you need to go where jobs are available.

susan I was glad to hear from you and hope the polyp gets sorted so you can enjoy food again without pain and throwing up. that must have been horrible and I definitely get your desire for real food again.

tina i agree with dee that medications are very specific to each individual. I think it may be a case of trying an anti depressant with or without an anti anxiety medication and see how you go. It takes a few weeks to get into your system. Anti depressant therapy for me is a life long necessity without them I crash and burn, but for some people may only be necessary for a few months. they don't fix you or whatever you are going through but they stop the crashing lows and kind of even out your mood a little so that you can be more objective and calmer.

 

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Susan, I sure hope that you are on the mend, that you are feeling a bit better each day. Keeping you in my prayers for a full recovery.

It was 64 degrees here today on December 4th and now, old man winter is trying like hell to burst through the wall of warm weather we have had...the wind gusts are 45 mph, whistling winds and branches down...by morning, the temps will be in the low 30's and should not climb out of the 30's for several days. This is as it should be, cold weather to kill the mold on the leaves which plague allergies, but also, this global warming and environmental change is very disturbing. I am holding you all in my heart and hoping for goodness and good sleep.

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Gosh Dee, looks as if winter is at your doorstep. I do hope that you will get some of the white stuff to add a touch of Christmas feeling to things.

Dianne, how was your visit with your daughter? How nice to have that chance to see her again. I bet you were looking forward to it.

Susan, I have been thinking of you and wondering how you are feeling the past couple of days. I'm sure you are glad to be home yet hope that they will resolve this issue so that you will be feeling better soon. I'm really happy that your daughter is there to help out. 

Lesley, is your operation next week? Will you have a very long stay in the hospital? I certainly hope that your family will be able to help you out once you are home recovering. Keep us posted and good luck.

Tina, how is the job search coming along? Anything look promising that appeals to you? Is your son excited about Xmas?

Leah, did you get that Colorado Low blast of winter yesterday? We had the edge of it, but it sure was windy and snowy. The snow is perfect condition for skiing. Powdery and light. How are you feeling this week? I hope your lung condition is beginning to settle down. 

Sherry, I see that it has been  heavenly in your neck of the woods. I can't believe those temps. Please send some our way.

Georgina, how are things?

I'm thinking of everyone and wishing you all peace in your day.

Kate

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thanks Kate. I had a call to say my surgery has been postponed until jan 11th. We are very fortunate to have a National Health service with free health care paid for in our taxes. one of the issues that poses is a wait time for non urgent surgeries. I am 19 months on from the original ankle fractures with chronic pain so waiting a bit longer is not an issue. Actually it also means i will be stable over the Xmas period too, ok walking is limited but at least I can walk with a stick and boot and can still drive until the day of my op so a bit more freedom. The surgery itself will be day surgery with a recovery time of more than 6months and physiotherapy afterward. it will be fine I am kind of used to anaesthetics and ops now having had 5 already on this stupid ankle. The big downside of having severe osteoporosis, but hey things could be worse so I'll take it!

Our weather is all over the place too. It has been very mild then we had a cold spell with near freezing temps now milder again but with another cold snap forecast. We very very rarely get snow here in the south west unless it is a sprinkling. It has been mainly dry though. I have had to use my blue light box most days as the winter sun is very low and weak, not enough to hold the SAD off.

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I have been off the site since about nov. 15th.  I was thinking maybe lack of response was maybe an indication that not only was I not helping anyone but was maybe saying the wrong things and making people feel worse. While I have got so much compassion and support here and I still need, I also try to reach out to anyone who is having a rough time and try to be open and honest about what my experiences have been or even just inquire about others lives as I know we all need support for our daily lives sometime.  Please know I would never intentionally hurt anyone and I am sorry if I have. Despite what I have been told and I try not to dwell quite as much on it as I used to, I carry a tremendous amount of guilt about not responding to Kira’s collapse.  I can hear that sound as clear as day and despite being the most over reacting mother I cannot say why I did not run up stairs when I heard that sound.  I know for sure I could have saved her from drowning but I don’t know about the arrthymia. How ever slim I was her only chance and it is a horrible burden to bear. I just did not want to live with the fact I was the cause of making someone feel bad as that would be more guilt and I simply can’t hold anymore.  .  I am aware the suffering from low self esteem, grief and depression, that my mind can be very convincing that I cause nothing but misery to others and am a totally worthless person.  But Kate is right when she says “ there is a common understanding that simply nobody can begin to connect with beyond here on the site”.  That is so true. We are aliens from the loss of a child planet even if we don’t show it on the outside, we are terribly scarred on the inside and always will be.   I have a hard time talking to anyone who hasn’t lost a child now because they are so shallow and unconcerned, only happy that it wasn’t their kid.  I have thought of nothing much but getting my life in order since Kira died.  I’m obsessed with how I’m leaving things for my boys.  I won’t even let myself entertain the thought that my boys might marry and have children someday. One of the things I have learned in six years is to have no hopes or dreams anymore.  Well I guess I’m just rambling now I don’t even know what I’m trying to say here. Of course this time of year brings its own set of challenges and January 21 st is Kira’s birthday and I am starting to feel it already.  Do you ever think what it might feel like to have the sweet, sweet relief of not carrying this horrific heartache anymore.  I do.  

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Fifty years ago yesterday my dearest and closest friend died. She was my best friend. It was a slow and lingering death. She suffered from heart disease. Today she most likely would have survived given the advances made in heart research. Her family fell apart. Particularly her Mom. Before long her mother took her own life. I watched as her other children SUFFERED beyond belief that not only did they lose their young sister, but now their Mom. The question they must have asked themselves was did she only love her? What about them? They were still very much alive and needed their mother! When you reach a point that your thoughts are so dark... then it is vital to get the professional help and support that you require. We all wish this had not happened. The only question I ask myself is "why"? Lou Ann, we all have pushed ourselves to adjust our lives to living without our child. The pain is indeed horrible. Still, we keep going. I have another son and granddaughters. I love them dearly. I would never put them through what my friend's mother did. She was broken and clearly not thinking clearly. If only she had gone for help They never got over it.

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Luanne, I have read pretty much everything on here and NEVER have I seen you be unkind or uncaring.  You may not realize it but YOU offer comfort so many times.  I went through a really bad time the last weeks of November as we reached another marker and hope I never get so low again----but I know it will happen.  It is the nature of our grief.  If your thoughts are in the direction you are alluding to--PLEASE get some help.  You are important and Kira knows and always knew that. We all have the "what ifs" so many times and probably always will.  Your boys--- can you imagine your boys having to deal with losing you?  You are their mother and a most important part of their lives. Yes someday they may marry and have children---and those children will be a part of you. How will your sons cope knowing that their children would not know what a wonderful mom they had that encouraged and loved them but left them?  Yes, this journey is the worst ever and sometimes the pain can feel so overwhelming.  But if you are in a dark place and feel that there is no way out you need to reach up your hand to a professional, a help line SOMEONE who can reach that hand and help to pull you back.  Kira wants you get help because she will never accept your giving in.  She knows you better.  You may not feel like it is what you want but you are a good mom and you know that when darkness surrounds you you have to be the one to try.  You can do it.  You have come so far--yes maybe a few steps back but you are making it.  Don't let NOT asking for help ever be a 'WHAT IF".

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Dianne....please know I am thinking of you and yours.....I so understand that 'dark space' you entered into....I think it was the 3rd or 4th year....it seemed as if November came and every physical....emotional....spiritual side....had a spear in it....and my soul was on a journey of seeking. Seeking what....I did not know. It was a week-end and I was home alone...had lots to do.....I finally turned on QVC....not to buy anything...but to hear 'women's voices'....I was born into a crowd...grew up hearing women talk and talk and talk. The things we do just to get by.....may seem strange to other's but....most of us on this site can nod their head in agreement. I am so glad you can be by your cousin's side...you will be able to know how to walk beside her and give her the right empathy. Both of you share so many of the same life lessons...and walks of life. I do have a ray of hope in that you get to enjoy some time with your daughter....what a gift for you.

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louann we all hear you. Your pain and misplaced guilt need help to be reined in otherwise you yourself will buckle under the strain of carrying them. As my friends have suggested so eloquently in their posts seeking more help is really essential to your well being and also for your family's well being too. Giving up is not an option you are needed by so many people. The holidays definitely magnify loss i think we all feel that. just remember you have come this far and there are many friends on this site who also care about you. Your posts have always been kind and thoughtful i think your depression is twisting your self belief and esteem making you believe you are not good enough. Read these posts ,we value you and your opinions and want you to come out of the dark place you are in because you are worth it and deserve some peace and healing after losing Kira. We are all here to hold your hand ok?

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LouAnn, as you can see you are very much a part of our community and we all do care about you. You are having a really difficult time carrying so much guilt that is misplaced. It was not your fault that you did not respond as quickly as you felt you should have. The others on the site that posted today gave very good advice. Please reach out to someone that can guide you through this very difficult process. Keep posting on the site. You have always given support to everyone and are very much needed by all of us. Things will improve in time. It will not always be this hard. 

How about those Jets? Not too shabby. Although they lost last night. Have you been watching the games at all? 

Dee, how are you getting along with your shopping for the families that your kids are gifting? Lovely idea and so much appreciated I'm sure.

Susan, I hope that each day sees a slight improvement. 

Lesley, I am pleased that your operation is postponed until after Christmas. So much nicer to enjoy the holidays with your kids. Did you ever finish your cacti garden? 

Well my mind is a sieve these days. I have now sent multiple Christmas cards to the same people. Wow! I'll be glad when the 12th. is over. We are setting up tables and sorting toys next week for a local group. It will keep us busy and I know that Jeff will be pleased that we are foraging ahead. I think of you all even if I don't always mention names. Have a good evening.

Love to ALL, Kate

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I am slowly getting more in balance every day....I vowed to get a tiny bit better and a tiny bit stronger every day....it is slow...slow....and for me....that is a hard pill to swallow...thanks to each one of you that have me in your heart and thoughts.....here is a photo of our Veto...thinking my Northern Sisters would really like this....his helmet comes off for good in two weeks....he is a tough trooper.....

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Veto and the BLACKHAWKS! Whoo-hoo for that. The team will welcome him with open arms. I am so glad to know that you are getting better but I do know how hard this must be for you Susan, you are so used to going '240' and doing several things at once. This is time to slow it way down, and perhaps this forced slow-down will allow you to just sit quietly for a bit and soak in the sunlight and the sounds and give you something unexpectedly lovely. I hope so anyhow. These photos are precious. Thanks for sharing. Save that helmet, just in case he plays hockey when he is older and comes to Chicago.

Louanne, I am so sorry that you felt that folks were not responding to you in your need. I have to say that I felt you were letting us know that you and your husband were finding ways to get out of the house and force some time doing some things that allowed your world to expand a bit. I felt that you had a lot of positive feedback here, that everyone was happy for you and that you felt that Kira was happy for this change. I would have never guessed that you felt that you were not getting the responses that others were getting. It is a crowded house here, but I feel that everyone gets a good representation of response. Please come back and let us know what you are going through right now. Yes, everyone here has felt that it may be nice to not feel what we feel when we are in the depths of our losses, but we all also know and recognize that your statement sounds like a hint at taking your life, and nobody wants that, not anyone. YOu need some help dear, not for any other reason but the fact that this loss of Kira is killing you, the guilt is killing you. Get help so that your kids can see that you are willing to find ways to live your best life for them and you.

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Susan, thank you so much for warming my heart on this chilly winter evening. Those pictures of your family are beautiful! I hope that you let everyone spoil you as you have them over the many years that I have known you. You deserve it. Get well soon.

Well I have to say that I think I solved the fox situation. Or should I say it resolved itself. I have never actually seen a fox as tame as this one. He or should I say she is now coming to eat the oiled sunflower seeds from our feeder that have fallen to the ground. Between the fox and deer and birds along with a pair of rabbits...gosh this feeder is getting a workout. And all getting along without trying to kill each other. Cute as the Dickens. The temps have dropped considerably this evening. Tonight they are calling for a low of -18C. but it has already reached that. Still it is warm and cozy inside. Love to All for a warm and peaceful night.

Kate :)

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Oh I am overwhelmed by all your kindness and support.  I wish I could hug each and everyone of you.  Strange to me you would think I was alluding to suicide.  Those thoughts are a constant train of thought to me and have been since I was a very young girl.  I just wrote them down this time that’s all.  They just got worse when I lost Kira. It’s just part of growing up with no confidence or self esteem.  I was instilling those things on Kira. There is no way I would let her grow up like me.  Most of the time I can just ignore or say shut up but sometimes they can drag me back into the hole. I am so glad I didn’t offend anyone.  Leslie’s right depression can really warp your way of thinking.  Thanks again for your kindness. I don’t know what I did to deserve such good friends but I cherish everyone of you.  We’ll post more later about where I am at but just wanted to let you know I feel much better now and like I am back home.  

Yes kate am watching every game I can. Some nights there are games on from 730 right thru til midnight. Kinda a hockey heaven for me.  

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Luanne, so glad you posted back. You are an integral part of our group...I like the way that term "our group" sounds...and we are all different and yet united by one goal..learning to live after the worst loss imaginable. You know you hold Kira in your heart. She is never far from you, her dad, her brothers... Sometimes we slip and sadness and even agony swallows us but life is there. Hold onto it with both hands. That is Kira you just heard saying, "you got this mom, you can do it."

Susan, thank you. I cherish the words when someone helps me relate to the bumps in this road. I think my last bump was a ravine.!  Coming back up for air maybe made me a little stronger, a little more able to get back on my feet...for now. Hoping every day brings a bit of healing to you. That Veto...what a doll. Yea for the Blackhawks helmet even though they could use getting back on their feet this season. The light in your granddaughter's face speaks volumes.

So yesterday my husband and I went to my cousin's to help go through pictures to create a "slideshow" for her son's memorial. Thanks to you all here and the things I've learned I think we did well in giving her and her husband a bit of comfort. Yes there were some sad moments but there were even some fond memories and a small bit of laughter. Her husband said that was a good afternoon and they needed that. Tim and I knew we needed it too. Paying it forward...

 

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see Luanne you are needed and your opinions valid. the holidays are tough for all of us. Let us all support each other, when one or two are down the others can help pick them up and so the circle of care continues. All of us are important.

Dianne I bet the slideshow really helped, going through photos is really hard, so having you and your hubby there to help was very important and undoubtedly made a sad occasion a little easier. using your own knowledge of grief is invaluable help. No one knows grief like those who have walked that path personally.

susan Veto is adorable precious photos.

I have put up my decorations but the tree still needs doing. It does not feel the same anymore but that is ok I am doing it for my other children. i often still feel really numb. I have always had a soft heart and would cry over sad books or movies etc but now find that although I still feel touched I do not cry. probably because i have shed so many tears over the last couple years, and also the fact that once you lose a child nothing else seems to compare. I have bought Tommy's ornament for the tree for this year and will once I am paid will send a check to my local homeless centre in Tommy's name as his Xmas present. paying it forward like dianne said. You never know when you will need the generosity of others as life can be really crappy so helping others is important.

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We have sparse decorations and somehow that is enough. The Kids live only a few blocks from us and they have two trees and the walks we take give us beautiful scenes of lights and sparkle...at lunch today, I walked to the park near my old house where my kids were raised most of their young years, and where there is a tree for Erica. I hung a silver sparkly ornament from her, had a little talk with her, went back to school. I will hang some ornaments next week on the tree in the park at the school where I teach, where my Kids went to school. My students can help.

It has been such a busy active week, I am good and tired and look forward to bedtime and my book. I am listening to a band I really like and many of you may like them if you give a listen: War on Drugs is the name of the band. Talented.

Lesley, funny, I cry over the tiniest things and always have. For a couple of years I was on some meds for my anxiety and I could not cry, no tears would come...it was odd, I mean I cry over the news almost daily, I cry when I see talented ice skaters, I cry from a song, a lovely story...you name it. heart on my sleeve.

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Dianne and Lesley, thanks. I know your right. But sometimes I can go along ok and then for whatever reason take a dive back into the hole.  The other day I was trying so hard just to hold my own. I was cleaning up in Aaron’s room and came across a picture of Aaron and Kira at summer camp years ago that I had never seen before.  Any bit of progress or tiny step I had made that day was totally wiped out. It just took looking at one picture to just gut me again. One step forward, two back. I have managed to put out two or three decorations and a tiny spindley 3 foot silver Charlie Brown tree up. Very low key and no lights but just a little something for when the boys come home. Randy said why are you putting that junk out. After six years of totally rejecting everything Christmas it was a start.

But I understood what my husband was thinking.  Why bother. Xmas is just another day to “get thru”. Lesley has kindly been babysitting me the last few weeks and convinced me to be the one to show my family it is ok to live again.  There is just no way randy or the boys will do that.  I have just ordered a few things on line for the boys.  Nothing like I used to do. But I need a few things like socks and underwear; etc.  So I had my husband take me to a mall a couple times this week.  I knew what I was in for, the carols, decorations, the moms with their daughters. But I soldiered in anyway.  While it was difficult I simply drew up enough courage and told myself I had to this....for my boys.  Both boys have girlfriends. Which is the only happy spot I have had much in six years.  I am so glad they have someone and very nice girls.  So when I was looking for little things like nail polish or hand cream I so so much wanted to be buying three of them instead of two.  I did a little shopping and as pathetically weak as this sounds I would tell myself, dee is teaching, Kate is playing with her foxes, Dianne is comforting her cousin, Susan was recovering, Lesley was maybe putting up her tree and maybe Tina was seeing a dr. About some meds, etc, etc,  but is what I told myself is I knew there were others bereaved moms out there  with hearts just as broken as mine. But I knew no matter the pain, you all got up this morning and went about your day what ever that entailed doing the best you could, so somehow I had to too.   Sometimes just knowing somebody knows your pain and is there for you is all that matters.  Yesterday a man in Toronto went thru a Tim Hortons (coffee) drive thru and said to the clerk I’ll pay for the guys behind me and tell him to have a good day.  As it turned out that man had planned on committing suicide later that day but changed his mind because somebody showed him they care.  So Lesley you are right the circle of care continues. Thanks to all of you for my much needed boost this week.   And yes Dianne I did hear Kira say you got this mom. You can do it.  

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Well Louanne, it sounds to me that you took your lessons to heart and made your way to the malls and to finding ways to be present in order to provide for your family. Yes, Kira must have been singing...so glad that Her Mom was out there doing this kind of work. We all do get up each day, and somehow make it to the end of the day where we can sigh and realize that being busy is sometimes the answer to our finding our way.  Do you think it would help your husband if you and he bought a few new decorations, ones that were not part of your traditions previously?

Lesley, how nice that you are being mentor-like, how wonderful that you are helping Luaanne through this piece of time.

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I haven't seen a dr yet. I can't afford to. I am so struggling to get by. I....idk.  Barely making it. I know I need everyone on here. I so need you all. Someone asked me the other day how I was doing. It was the first time I didn't have a response. I usually say ok. I'm getting by. This time I told her I honestly cannot tell you how I feel. I can't explain. Honestly, if I think about it, I'm drowning. I don't want to do anything. I don't want to think. I don't want to do anything. I just want to lay in bed. I cannot and will not believe she is gone. Too painful. Too heartbreaking. If I believe, it will tear me in two again. I cant

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