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Grief & Healing from a Christian-Biblical Worldview


4everjoeysmom

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A book that I find very helpful is Quiet Times for Those Who Need Comfort by H. Norman Wright. A friend who has lost her son gave it to me when my husband died. It is short meditations based on the Bible. I keep it in the car and am on my 3rd time through it. I've read all the books I've seen mentioned here and have found this one to be the best for me. Mary Jo

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momofonewhosoars

This was Monday's Grace for Grief and I want to share it as I needed it a lot

[align=center]Monday:[/align]

"The more words there are, the more pointless they become. What advantage do mortals gain from this?" (Ecclesiastes 6:11)

I know they mean well, Lord, but sometimes people say the most senseless things, and in doing so, they cause more harm then good. I don't need answers from the, just their friendship. In the meantime, Lord, thank you for always being a friend that sticks closer than a brother.

Today's Reading: James 3

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Hello all,

What an incredible blessing it is to come here and share about our grief in a Christian setting.  For me this has meant a renewed grief work passage that I've needed after a time of numbness.  I do think that numbness and denial are on the list of tools or resources the Lord has given us to get through devastating loss.  But those tools are part of the balance (as you said Claudia), and we've got to walk through the sharp pain and sorrow as well.  I find He is surely with me, which explains why I can function at all! 

Anne, welcome to this site.  I'm sorry for your horrible loss.  Your son is so handsome!  And you know that in heaven now all of his handsomeness and inner beauty shine through in glory to God.  I have a photo of my son Phil that was taken when he was about 10, in which his expression is so beautiful and warm that even back then when the photo was taken, I would look at it and cry.  Now all that I have left of Phil is photos.  Well, I hope that you can come to this site to find comfort and fellowship among other Christian bereaved.  We do have a hope above all futile worldly wishes.  We have a sure hope, grounded upon His word.

Trish,  I know how hard it is to look ahead to the rest of your life without your son, but God will be with you walking through every moment, every day.   And that's whether you feel His presence or you don't.  I know how hard it can be to get back to prayer.  I was praying for God's will to be done in my kids' lives for a long time and then Phil died.  My pastor explained to me that it may not have been God's perfect will for Phil to die when he did, but God is sovereign and He can use whatever happens in this sin-stained world for His glory.

Sal,  I went to your memorial website for Joshua.  Now I feel I know you a little better.  And you guys get snow like we do -- I live in Western New York, though this year we have had hardly any snow.   You had made a comment a day or two ago that in spite of humiliation you've gone through your worth is derived from your standing as one of God's daughters.  That is so true.  Whenever we have to deal with shame or guilt, whether real or imagined, we have to find our emotional safety in our identity as God's children.  I would be a quivering pile of Jell-o in the corner if I didn't ultimately fall back on that fact.   I also read the Wish List of the bereaved parent on your site.  That puts it exactly right - especially the part that says, I wish you could understand and I pray you never will understand.  This grief is something you would not wish on anyone.

Claudia,

WOW!  You've put it all so beautifully!  I was thinking "Preach it, sister!" while reading your last message where  you quoted the "armor" portion of Ephesians.  I have had a long struggle against the Enemy's accusations concerning my parenting. There have been large blocks of time where I was convinced that the entire reason my sons died was me and my stupid choices.   I had gone through a period of time when I was so focused on my own college studies, as a single Mom, that looking back I felt my son Phil did not understand how important he was to me.  He was always the "quiet one" who never asked for much of anything.  He was the seven-year-old who said to his grandma "No thanks Gram, I have some dollars at home" when she tried to slip him a bit of money at a family gathering, for example.  Self-effacing all the way.  Later, when I was remarried and Phil was 20 years old, he had his accident, which was started by him driving wrecklessly toward the end of a pier, because he was depressed and had argued with his girlfriend.  Though Phil had confessed Jesus as Lord when he was younger, he was not outwardly living for the Lord and he was having struggles with depression.  So his accident, was started by a depressive impulse, though Phil tried to pull out of the accident and really did not want to die that night.   I had been concerned about how Phil was doing and had written him a long letter that I nearly handed to him on the last day I saw him alive.  But I was thinking that I needed to rephrase part of it, since I thought one part of the letter might make him feel worse.  He was a sensitive soul and I wanted to avoid hurting him at all costs.  The letter was all about my concern for him, explaining to him how I'd learned to care for myself emotionally, things that I thought I could share since Phil was now an adult.  I had also urged Phil to come and live with my new husband and me, since it was more likely he could find  a job and do better for himself in our area an hour's drive away (Phil had stayed with his Dad when we split).  This letter was a heartfelt cry to my son, from whom I felt somewhat separated. Imagine my  guilt when Phil died two days after I failed to give him this letter.  There were other dynamics involved as well, with my younger son Matt having stayed with me when we split (my two daughters were grown and out of the house by then).  Matt was the traditional spoiled baby of the family.  As my first son Phil held a singular place in my heart, but the family situation may have obscured that fact for him.   With the emotional abuse of my ex-husband ever present for Phil,  it was not surprising that Phil was having struggles.  Only looking back did I see that it was a horrible mistake to allow Phil to stay with his Dad, who was weirdly abusive (not physically) in a way that was hard to desribe to people, yet real to anyone in the same house with him.  Two lawyers and two counselors told me that Phil would end up resenting me and fighting me if I tried to force him to move with me.  But in Phil's 14 year old mind did that mean that he thought Mom was leaving HIM too?  By staying with his Dad, did he think that guarenteed that I would not move out?  These are the guilty feelings that I've had to fight off and on for the seven years since Phil died.  I was never satisfied that I did enough to let Phil know how much I loved him. Then there is the fact that Matt killed himself as a direct result of Phil's death.  Matt is another whole story.  The whole family, and friends, even acquaintances had rallied around Matt when we knew his grief was heavy over his brother.  He knew he could call on at least a dozen people in the middle of the night if necessary.  But he also had a head injury that had depressed him even more, with the total loss of his senses of taste and smell.  Despite the strong support of many people, Matt still cried out to God one night by shooting himself.

This leads me to how grief has changed life for me.  Now I truly would be happy to go to heaven any day.  I trust God with everything because I have control of nothing.  I remember the delusion of feeling that life will just keep going on, not taking death seriously, from before my sons died.   Now I understand that we really do control nothing,and we have to trust God for EVERYTHING.  How we often delude ourselves into thinking that if I just do thus and so, everything will go this way or that.  It just ain't so.  Though I know God hears my prayers, and always answers them in one way or another, I have to understand that He is sovereign.  He is in control of all.  

After the boys died I avoided reading the Book of Job for a year or two.  When I did get to reading it I found that I understood it SOOO much better than previously.  I love the Nichole C. Mullen song Redeemer, and have sung it as part of giving my testimony about God's help through grief.  It quotes Job "I know my Redeemer lives, and that one day He will stand upon the earth..."  People have been encouraged by the way God has helped me to endure and that is a comfort to me, too.

Another thing that has changed is my physical state.  There is long list of physical effects of grief that is acknowledged by the medical community.  I now have dry eyes, IBS and some liver problem that they haven't figured out yet.  No, I don't drink! Except for approximately 4 to 5 weak rum and cokes PER YEAR (I actually use the word "wimpy" when ordering the drink!), and I take Tylenol about as often.  So those causes are ruled out.  My counselor says that the dry eyes are likely caused by a constant state of "fight or flight" caused by the traumas, as if my body is always on alert for the next tragedy, so my eyes never close all the way, even when I'm sleeping.  And I often don't have energy to exercise, so I'm not in great shape like I used to be.  However, I am blessed with a husband who is very supportive, often encouraging me to take it easy, to do grief work and spend time in the Word and prayer.   I pray that you will find the times of slowing down exactly when you need them, Claudia.  And I know what it's like to lose power and water for extended times -- I lived in the Philippines for two years, many years ago!  I do admire your pluckiness in this ministry you have entered.  You are a great example. 

I also recommend the Randy Alcorn book Heaven -- great stuff in there and I've always thought heavenly existence will be much more than sitting around on clouds playing harps!  I think that heaven will be like going with your Dad to work.  We'll get to see how God does things, how He runs the universe, how He creates.  Of course we can only begin to imagine it!  There are so many more topics I'm probably forgetting, but know that you are all in my prayers, and I do mean that.  I feel much closer to this group of grievers than I did with another group I looked into on Shoutlife (Christian networking site).  You folks are truly a blessing to me and I know to others as well. 

Love in Christ, Rody

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Oneta,

I just read your posting from this morning and identify with it so much.  Thank you for what you shared.  Your story of Psalm 13 on posted on your computer is a perfect illustration of how God helps us soldier through with His Word.  You are so right -- grief tests our faith in a way nothing else can.  I once heard a preacher rightly saying that, much as we hate it, the hard times and grievous losses are what bring about our growth.  Being fat, happy and stagnant just doesn't stimulate much growth in our spirits. 

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Momofonewhosoars:  Thank you for sharing that.  Sometimes it does all just sound like noise, doesn't it?

Rody:  I had to deal with guilt a lot, too, in regard to my husband's death.  It happened long ago, as I have explained in other posts, but the guilt stayed with me for over 30 years.  That's part of the lie that I was believing.  I was feeling, like you, that I was responsible for his death by not doing more the day he died, by not seeing the symptoms he was having, by staying in denial and refusing to believe he would die, and more.  The devil was really pummeling me, and I was a bloody mess from it.  When God revealed to me - and it was just that - a revelation - not anything that came from any warfare on my part or anything else because I was so exhausted from the beating I was getting - God just "showed me" in a very miraculous way and just set me free from the guilt.  I can't explain it in any other terms.  It came in a flash and suddenly I could see that there was nothing I did or didn't do that caused what happened.  There is a scripture (even using the internet I can't find it) that says "our times are in His hands".  I don't believe that God knows the exact day of our deaths ahead of time (just my belief maybe), but I know that our lives are under His control.  So I can be at peace about my husband's death.  I don't like it.  I loved him more than I can even say.  He was my life, my breath, my heartbeat, and I miss him even today all these years later.  But I know, like all of you, that I will see him again someday and there will be no more tears, no more sad farewells, no more grief, no more separation.  Just thought I'd share that with you.

~Oneta

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Sal and all of you moms who have other children after the loss of a child:

There is a great article today on BI about how to talk to your children about the loss of their sibling.  It's (for some reason I can't understand) under the title "I dreamed about him".  It must have been mistitled.  Whatever.  Anyway, it's a really good article.  Since you had asked me about my perspective of having lost a sibling when I was young, I thought you would be interested in reading it.  ~Oneta

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Claudia, Oneta, Rody, your words have touched my heart and given me such comfort. It is such a blessing for all of us Claudia, that you started this forum. It is wonderful to come here and be with other Christians that are on this journey. Your words and sharing has really helped me out of my darkness. I had a very good day and I know it is the Lord and the added blessings I have received from coming to this forum.  I will be looking for the books you have mentioned. I feel a true blessing to have found this sight. Love and prayers to all, Love Lana

 

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4everjoeysmom

Nothing blesses us more than to know that anything at all we've shared has helped and blessed someone else's day, especially when that someone is our Sister.  We love you Lana!  I'm so happy you had a brighter day today.  :)

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i lost my mom Jerri in the picture on the left a few months ago it was in July but it seems like just a few months ago, please keep me in your prayers thanks so much - i will remember all of you in prayer as well

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loveyoujustin

OK, THIS IS FOR ALL OF YOU.  i THANK YOU FROM THE VERY BOTTOM OF MY HEART FOR ALL OF YOUR REPLYS TO MY POSTING OF LAST NIGHT.  I TRULY FEEL THAT THIS IS WHERE I BELONG.  I DON'T FEEL ANY TRUER COMFORT, OR UNDERSTANDING ANYWHERE ELSE, NOT HOME, NOT WITH MY DEAREST FRIENDS, AND NOT WITH MY LOVING FAMILY. tHERE IS NO OTHER PLACE WHERE I CAN TRULY SPEAK FROM MY BROKEN HEART, AND MISPLACED SOUL, WITHOUT RESTRAINT FOR ONE REASON OR ANOTHER.   I HAVEN'T POSTED FOR A WHILE, BUT AFTER READING THE POSTS HERE, AND YOUR REPLYS, I FEEL "DRAWN" TO ALL OF YOU, AND PARTICULARLY THIS THREAD.  I AM CERTAIN, THAT IN MY DOUBTS, AND MY SEARCH FOR TRUTH AND KNOWLEDGE, GOD HAS LED ME HERE, TO YOU, TO HELP ME NOT ONLY WITH MY SORROWFUL JOURNEY, BUT WITH MY SPIRITUAL JOURNEY AS WELL.  AND ALTHOUGH I AM JUST BEGINNING, REALLY ON BOTH JOURNEYS, AND I FOR SURE DO NOT HAVE THE EXTENSIVE KNOWLEDGE AND FAITH THAT MOST OF YOU HAVE, I AM READY TO BEGIN.  THANK YOU AGAIN DEAR FRIENDS, I KNOW I AM BEGINNING ON THE RIGHT PATH.  MY LOVE AND PEACE TO ALL OF YOU TONITE.      TRISH

WWW.JUSTINSCOTTWAGNERMEMORIALFUND.COM   (VIDEO TAKES ABOUT 3 MINS. TO DOWNLOAD.  I WANT EVERYBODY TO KNOW HIM, MY BELOVED JUSTIN.

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4everjoeysmom

Trish,  I really am happy you feel drawn to be here with us in sharing and traveling this journey together.  I believe with all of my heart that each one of us will find strength and comfort , complete understanding and loving compassion amongst one another here.  And the beauty of it is that we will grow together as well.  It's a very painful journey, no doubt.  It's a blessing none of us have to travel alone.  Your son is SO handsome.  It's kind of difficult to imagine even more perfection in his glorified body.  I think that sometimes of Joey too, as I'm sure maybe we've all tried to picture what that might be like.

Sheela, welcome, and I am so very sorry for your loss.  Prayers are being lifted on your behalf.  Please stick with us on your journey if you find it helpful.  Blessings and Hugs, Claudia

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Lana,

I'm glad to hear you are feeling better! The dark times are so hard. I'm learning to take the good days and be so very thankful for them.

Trish,

Thank you for sharing Justin with us. He is a very handsome! I have to start working a a site for Danielle. I'm just not so good with computers.

Sheela,

Welcome to this site. My prayer is that is will help you as much as it's helping me!

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Lana, Trish, Sheela:  I feel the same as all of you that this thread and all of you are so helpful in helping work through the great grief that we all feel.  It is good that we have each other to lean on, to pray for us and to pray for, to draw strength from and give strength to, to walk together through this hard time we're all in.  God bless all of you.  ~Oneta

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thank you every one so much for your kind words and nice replies i feel at home here also..  i too am so sorry for everyones loss.. i came across some pictures and thought wow this is now our loved ones on the beach in heaven.. it uplifted me so much i thought i would post one or two of them for inspiration.

this could be my mom or one of your daughters etc in heaven right now. happy & healthy again.

 

this might be someones son, father etc down here 

 

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4everjoeysmom

Not sure what the pictures are, Sheela, becuase I couldn't see them.  But they sound nice... :)

 

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4everjoeysmom

Word and Scripture for today:

Heb 13:8 Jesus Christ is the same yesterday and today and forever.

Say to yourself and Believe....  "If I can have the promise of omnipotent help from Jesus who is the same yesterday today and forever, my heart will be strong, and I will be able to carry on another day. Such is the glory of grace in the Christian life."

Blessings and Hugs, Claudia

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Hello, everyone.  I don't have much really to say today, but just wanted to drop in and say hello to everyone.  My thought as I write is that I praise God that He has vanquished this enemy called Death and that He has removed the sting of it.  One day we will all be with Him and with our loved ones and there will be no more sad farewells, no tears, no sadness.  Under His mercy, Oneta

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Ladies,

Please say a pray for me today. I'm going to my part-time job (waiting tables) that I shared with my daughter Danielle and it's hard going back when she's not there. The customers are great and really loved Danielle so I will get to hear about her tonight but I still cry when I talk about my precious gift Danielle. She was such a beautiful and kind person!! Thanks

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4everjoeysmom

Sonya, I am praying you through tonight as well.  I cannot even imagine how difficult these forst encounters back at work must be for you--so bittersweet,  I pray that people will be sensitive and kind, and that memories will bless you beyond the sadness.  Big Hugs, Claudia

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Sonya, my prayers are especailly with you tonight on the first time back to your job. Oneta, you are so right what a blessing we have to look forward in the kingdom of heaven. Claudia, what a great scripture I truly am blessed by it. I feel the inner strenght of the Lord the last few days I appreciate all of your prayers from everyone. As I pray everyday give me the strenght to get through another day and the Lord shall never leave us or forsake us. What a true blessing!!!!:) Love, Lana

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4everjoeysmom

HUGS, Lana!  I am jumping for joy in hearing how you are feeling your inner strength in Christ.  It's a miraculous thing, isn't it?  That became stronger for me in time through this journey, and I know it will for you too, as well as His comfort, peace, and again His joy....   He is with us!  Love, Claudia

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Claudia, yes what a wonderful blessing Christ has given me the last few days. I know he is always there but sometimes you are just so numb. I even had to change Brent's picture to one of his silly pictures. He was always such a cutup and so silly, God made so him special.:)  What a truly bright day guided by the Lord!! Love, Lana

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4everjoeysmom

I really like the beach a lot, and Joey always loved it too.  I have fondest memories of us by the water since he was a toddler all the way to his 20's.  He was my little guppy when he was little.  When he couldn't be at the beach, he was splashing in the tub and the pool.  For his junior college graduation I gave him a snorkeling and cruise package in Ft. Lauderdale, whiah he totally loved.  I heard all about the seafood smorgasboard.  For his 21st birthday I gave him a 4-day hotel package in Myrtle Beach, and a few of his friends went with him.  It was one of those "what happens in MB stays in MB weekends, I think.  But I'm sure the boys (Joey's friends) made awesome memories with him to hang onto.  I don't ever see photos of the beach or the real thing and not feel and think about Joey.  Thanks for sharing...

 

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Sheela,  Those are beautiful pictures!  Beautiful beaches and beautiful water.  I'm not a beach person per se, but I love good beach pictures, and I love the ocean.  I love to listen to the waves roll in.  It plays in a minor key, and  I can listen to it for hours on end.  Thanks for sharing them.  ~Oneta

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Lana,  I am so glad that the last few days have gone so much better for you.  We have a great comfort in the Lord that I am so thankful for.  My faith has grown so much in these last few years.  Something like this does test your faith, but they say that something not tested isn't really worth much.  ~Oneta

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Hello everyone,

I'm so glad that coming to this site has been a blessing for people.  Welcome Sheela.  I'm sorry about the loss of your mom.  You must have had a great, close relationship with her.  And what a lovely idea to think of sharing photos as a way of picturing the beauty that our loved ones experience in heaven.  Thank you!

It may sound odd to some, but one of the best things I've found for healing is laughter about the goofy stuff that my boys used to do.  My husband only knew my sons for a relatively short time before they died, but he knew enough about them to bring up amusing things they said or did in their lives.   MANY times Steve has given me laughs in the midst of sorrow, because he's said things like "Remember the time Matt was riding in the car with me and acting like he was ALL THAT to the girls he saw on the street?"  Or "Matt would think that car is 'phat'", etc.  I sometimes make time to watch funny movies or shows that the boys themselves liked.  To me it is a great way of remembering them while I feel as if I'm sharing the laughs all over again with them.  But of course, everyone has to grieve in her own way, and the same activities aren't right for everyone.  It's just a suggestion that's been a great help for me.  

I hope all of you have a good, blessed weekend, and keep holding onto the Lord.  He is with us every step of the way!   "For I am persuaded that neither life, nor death, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present nor things to come, nor height, not depth, nor any other creature will be able to separate us from the love of God which is in Christ Jesus our Lord."  Rom 8: 38-39 (I think)         Love in Christ,  Rody

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4everjoeysmom

Rody, Amen to the laughter!  There are things I can clearly think on now about Joey that make me wildly laugh at times, and it feels great.  As a metter fo fact, Joey was so funny so much of the time that during the week of his memorial, when his family gathered on the porch at his dad's to just be together, we would remember and share lots of funny stories and laugh, even in the midst of our pain.  I truly feel laughter in our lives is a gift, and it's wonderful when that gift arrives to conquer a moment of tears.  Sometimes the laughter and the tears come together too, and that's ok.

Thanksgiving 2005 we were at my dad's for dinner.  Patrick and his girlfriend had been there for a while, visiting with me and Michael at the kitchen table.  Patrick had been gaining some weight at the time, and it was noticeable, but he's generally a slim kid at 6'4.  Joey and his girlfriend walked in and everyone said their hello's.  Then Joey looked at Patrick, (serious as could be) and asked him, "What's wrong with your neck?"  We all looked at Patrick and Patrick looked a bit confused by the questions.  And he responded with a question, "What?" back to Joey.  And then as clear and serious as anything Joey said, "You don't have one!".... and I think I almost wet my pants.  There was so much roaring laughter for several minutes.  Of course we all gave Patricl lots of love and told him not to take it seriously, and he didn't.  Patrick is so kind and mellow in that way.  But oh my how that laughter still to this day will find it's way into my memory and spark a wave of similar laughter at just the thought.  We recollected that moment again as we sat on the porch 8+ months after the moment, and we all felt Joey's sense of humor in such a loving and connecting way.

Rody, thanks for sharing that, and the Scripture from Romans.  We are truly blessed that the Lord's love does not waiver, even when ours does.  It was said on another thread that "Love is ALL You Need".  I truly believe it IF it's the love of God--the only source of unblemished, perfect love.  Bless you, dear Sister, and all of you this fine Saturday.  Love, Claudia

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thank you Rodie and yes i find laughter very healing too. sometimes when i rememer something funny my mom said or did i have to laugh..

 

one time we were at the real ritzy fancy hospital waiting for my moms turn to have a part of my moms stomach stretch. it would get to small for the food to pass out and into the intestine and she would suffer a lot and be in pain and feel bloated. she had to have this done many, many times..

anyways we were at this hospital and we needless to say arent wealthy people at all, we were and still are very low income, but this hospital was where her stomach dr was at, so we had to go to this one. anyways  when we were sitting there, there nurse came running out and said smell it ? real loud to everyone sitting there.. my mom and i looked at each other and said smell what ?? what, did someone die ? what happened ? we didnt know what was wrong...

 

and she gave us such a funny look and a lady came and walked back with her and that was it... my mom and i both looked at each other and realised that she was saying snell it, miss snell it... it was miss snellit's turn....

we both had to break down laughing so hard.... no one person there laughed with us everyone there was so rude, the other patients etc.... but my mom and i really had to laugh... i guess there was a lady named that there.. we though for sure she said smell it ??

 

LOL 

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sometimes my mom comes to me in dreams, i believe that God can do anything he wants to even that. remember in the bible God sent a angel to st Joesph in a dream telling him to stay with Mary that it was ok and that her child was to be the son of God etc.. bc Joesph at first considered divorce as he knew for sure he never laid with her... and here she was pregnant a very scandilous thing back thing then.

 

anyways she comes to me in my dreams with different messages, sometimes it just to say i love you etc.. another time she came to me a few mornings ago with a song in the back ground of the dream it was that song by alabama called forever is as far as i will go.. it was her message to me that she will forever be with me etc..

see i have always had a little extra pychic thing going on so has my mom. many times i have dreamed right away of stuff before it happened etc.. when i was just 4 i woke up and saw the light fixture above my bed on fire and my mom heard me screaming and came over and was rocking me for a long time and i just couldnt stop seeing the fire all around the fixture. i was having like a very long vision i guess bc i was completly awake when i woke up and started to scream for her and i still sat and saw it for like a hour or so.  the next night the trailer across the street burnt down..and just a few years ago there was a bad electrical fire in that same house..

 

anyways God has given me a gift of some sort i just get feelings and sometimes they come true etc.. but i know i really see my mom in my dreams.. thats God way of comforting me bc he knows how much i miss her..

 

i have recently begun to be able to feel her and her thoughts too. just once in awhile.. i will be looking at something funny and will hear her think to me something about it... i cant explain it but i hear her thoughts at times i guess thats just how close we were and still are. like a few days ago i was walking home from the 16th street mall which is real close to where i live and i was feeling so lonely without her, i heard her thought to me and it was i am always here etc.. maybe it was a feeling from her too.. i dont know whow to explain it but i sometimes she communicates with me. God always communicates with us too we just have to be able to sit somewhere real quite and then we can hear his voice in our hearts.. the last few years i have worked hard at getting somewhere quite and just talking to him and asking him things and waiting for him to tell me in my heart. sometimes in my dreams he comes to me there to and tells me things. things that are encouraging and positive.. and uplifting.. i think everyone can hear him if they just practice a little bit going somewhere real quite and just focusing only on God.

 

he will communicate to anyone who is open to him and open to his messages..

 

sometimes in my dreams i am communicating how i feel to her to with songs.. just before i wake up i will have a song in my dream about the way i am feeling at that moment.. God just makes that happen somehow.. i was dreaming this morning

about a song called momma i am coming home by ozzy i dont ever listen to rock music at all but this one song by him is real pretty and soft, its about a guy whos coming home to his mom after missing her for so long..

i just miss my mom so much i guess that was my way of saying to to her, that i want to come home to see her etc..

 

 

 

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4everjoeysmom

Biblically, angels were used as messengers of God.  That's true.  And I do believe as Hebrews says, we can definitely be entertaining angels on this earth.  But in our loved ones passing, so many times we can mistakenly think on them as angels or at least having the same abilities as angels.  I remember my uncle saying to my cousins when my aunt died that she was now an angel.  But Scripture also tells us that "we will judge angels".  So while I beleve God and angels visit us in our dream, and we most certainly dream of loved ones at times and feel it is they who are communicating with us, I haven't been able to find anything biblically supportive of our loved ones actually being able to cross-communicate with us, the fully living.  I know the dying seem to have communications that are different than ours.  It's an intersting topic.  It is definitely comforting though that we can dream of our loved ones we miss so much.  I have only had a couple of dreams where I remember Joey being in them, but not actually having communication with him.  I wish I could dream of him more often.  I don't dream vividly often.  And rarely have I ever dreamed of my family, so it would be strange to train my subconscience to dream in a new way after all these years.  I do however wish so much I could dream more of Joey.  It would feel like a visit because I miss him so much...  I think our hearts and minds tap into various super-sensitivities in times of deep grief and mourning, and anything is possible with God.  That's true....

It sounds like you have a very special gift Sheela.  It is interesting for us all to take notice of how God uses us and speaks to us through special gifts he develops in us.  I pray whatever gifts we are given, we seek discernment and wisdom to guide us in using them so that all will bring glory to Him.  Amen!?  Love and Hugs, Claudia

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Hello Everyone, I had to catch up on all the posts since I haven't been able to be on here for about 1 week. I did post something on the other thread but I only had a very short time to use the computer that day. I sure missed alot of very helpful posts. I believe, like Trish and Lana do, that this thread has helped me more than you can know, as I stated before. God is sure working through all of you to help us. Claudia, Oneta, Rody,I hope I didn't miss anyone, but your scripture based comments have truly inspired me. What a miracle. You will never believe what has happened in my life since I was last on here. My husband asked me to help him and go to North Carolina to do some marketing for him. I live in Ohio. He asked me to drive to NC with him and I would stay here in NC for 2 weeks, by myself. He flew home. I was scared to death. How could I leave my home, leave Mike,(not thinking about him 24/7 like my husband said I was doing), but like I had wrote the week of the court appearance,I felt God was helping me. I know exactly how you, Claudia, felt when you wrote about "falling into darkness and despair, the enemy was twisting my pain deeper and deeper inside of me to lure me into a trap of despair and hopelessness."I also want to" learn the Godly perspective in claiming victory over lifes painful circumstances."After coming to this thread I too, felt "GOD'S VOICE BECOMING LOUDER THAN THE ENEMY'S VOICE" I just WANTED TO LET YOU KNOW WHAT ALL OF YOUR WORDS HAVE DONE FOR ME. I feel, how you all feel ,but I can never put it into words like all of you can. I am in N.C. I have been here 1 week. I am surviving. I am out in the "world" again. This was a major accomplishment. I even had to go buy clothes to fit me, you see I gained 40 lbs since Mikey went to Heaven. I was just wearing PJS and jogging suites at home. I didn't have any business attire that fit.I do not have access to computer when I am not in the office. I am in the office, today Sat, and not out marketing. Thanks to all of you and God Bless all of you on our journey.Love,

Patti(Big Mikes Mom)

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Hello Everyone, I had to catch up on all the posts since I haven't been able to be on here for about 1 week. I did post something on the other thread but I only had a very short time to use the computer that day. I sure missed alot of very helpful posts. I believe, like Trish and Lana do, that this thread has helped me more than you can know, as I stated before. God is sure working through all of you to help us. Claudia, Oneta, Rody,I hope I didn't miss anyone, but your scripture based comments have truly inspired me. What a miracle. You will never believe what has happened in my life since I was last on here. My husband asked me to help him and go to North Carolina to do some marketing for him. I live in Ohio. He asked me to drive to NC with him and I would stay here in NC for 2 weeks, by myself. He flew home. I was scared to death. How could I leave my home, leave Mike,(not thinking about him 24/7 like my husband said I was doing), but like I had wrote the week of the court appearance,I felt God was helping me. I know exactly how you, Claudia, felt when you wrote about "falling into darkness and despair, the enemy was twisting my pain deeper and deeper inside of me to lure me into a trap of despair and hopelessness."I also want to" learn the Godly perspective in claiming victory over lifes painful circumstances."After coming to this thread I too, felt "GOD'S VOICE BECOMING LOUDER THAN THE ENEMY'S VOICE" I just WANTED TO LET YOU KNOW WHAT ALL OF YOUR WORDS HAVE DONE FOR ME. I feel, how you all feel ,but I can never put it into words like all of you can. I am in N.C. I have been here 1 week. I am surviving. I am out in the "world" again. This was a major accomplishment. I even had to go buy clothes to fit me, you see I gained 40 lbs since Mikey went to Heaven. I was just wearing PJS and jogging suites at home. I didn't have any business attire that fit.I do not have access to computer when I am not in the office. I am in the office, today Sat, and not out marketing. Thanks to all of you and God Bless all of you on our journey.Love,

Patti(Big Mikes Mom)

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 i started listening to music when i was born bc my mom always had music on but when i got old enough like maybe a few years old i dont remember how old for sure, i started taking a little radio with me every single place i went to, even at home i always had a little radio on with music.

music has always been such a big part of mine and my moms life.. and my sister's too.. my mom always had a gift for music and could dance so well.. we shared such a big love for music.. i always have to have my little mp3 player with me where ever i go to..  growing up i can remember being real little like just around 2 or 3 and just loving music so much always listening to it, too. anytime we went anywhere at all even just a ride to school or when i was being pick up and or when we travel to my grandparents i would absolutely have to have my little radio and head phones with me LOL. it came to be such a thing every where we went if we went with someone else and i forgot my headphoes etc even if we were already a mile away we would have to go back and get them for me to listen to LOL..

i think its a cool  that God has somehow put music into my dreams...

i dont know how he does it but he does.. and it brings me such relief to have that in my dreams.. when i wake up after having a musical dream i feel so renewed.. its just a gift from God bc i think he sees how very hard her death has been on me.. i have never had to ever face anything like this before now at all. nothing even close to this.. the worst things i had ever experienced were so easy and light compaired to this.. i was listening to one of my moms old country songs that she liked this afternoon and i had to softly cry a little it made me think of her and miss her so much. there are times when i think i am going to be ok but then there are other times when i think all is lost i am so alone.. it just takes so long to recover i dont think we ever really do we just learn how to live with the grief and dispair and sadness.

we just learn to go on for them until we meet again. which will hopefully be soon for many of us.. i dont want to live to be a old lonely woman. i want to die in my sleep before i am 45 or 50 that seems like a good age to go to me.. its before hopefully one gets to be to old and feeble and ill all the time.

i always wonder how i will go and hope it will be peaceful and quite and serene.. i know God can and will take us home sooner than we think. Just like my mom she thought she would live a long time maybe till she was at least 80 something... and here she dies at 67... he will bring us home when he thinks the time is right.. i just get a loving feeling when i think of that glorius time to get to be with God and my mom and my loved ones  my grandpa and my uncle Johnny Applehaunse... he was so nice and kind to my mom when she had very few friends left he was there for us both. i also had a few other real sweet uncles one was uncle frank and uncle albert.. they were very kind to my mom..

 

speaking of my mom... when she was real little her mother took care of her grandmother till she died.. her grandma had stomach cancer and had to have most of her stomach removed, she was in much pain constantly and was completely taken care of by my mother's mom.. which would be my grandma.. well after my moms grandma the one with the stomach cancer died.. she was staying in her room the room she died in also.. and my mom was nearly alseep and saw her grandma rocking in a rocking chair the little old lady used to rock in probably when she was in a lot of pain to get  her mind off of it.. it was her ghost.. it scared her real bad.. the old lady was just sitting there and rocking..

and another time my mom was at a new apt with her sister and saw a man in a bathing suit appear to her at the end of her bed.. she rent running out of the room. but the point is that my mom had some sort of Godly gift too.. what for or why we will never know for sure but she had a gift of seeing things at times. i do too.. maybe by seeing the spirit's of others it has made my mom and i both more aware of God and that there is something else out there.. we arent alone... God is real and is here with us too..

 

 

 

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Hello Sheela, Patti, Claudia and anyone else who's been posting here... I don't want to leave anyone out, but these were the last ones to post.  My computer sometimes tells me when people have posted.  I hadn't gotten any messages that you all had posted, so I'm just now reading them. 

I just have to get in on the conversation.  I used to think that people in Heaven didn't communicate with us... that it was God/Holy Spirit, angels, whatever talking to us.  But anymore I'm not so sure.  I've always been a very frequent dreamer, and some of my dreams are from God, I know.  I had one dream many years ago when I was a girl that foretold of my little brother's death.  I won't go into the details, but it happened just like the dream.  Then after I was married, I had a dream two or three times, always the same dream, that warned me that my husband was going to die.  It was also very detailed and exactly what happened to the T.  I've had many, many dreams over the years, some that have happened and some were just dreams/subconscious or whatever, just like everyone else's dreams. 

In the last several years since my mother's death, I've come to see things a little differently.  Just before my mother's death (I need to interject that my mother, though she had always gone to church - I was raised "in church" - had no assurance of salvation and was very afraid to die) - she never seemed to understand the gospel when people would try to tell her she didn't have to fear death.  About a week or two before her death, she was very afraid one night and seemed to be trying to get away from something.  She kept saying, "No I won't go.  No, I won't go with you" over and over and over.  It worried me, so I repeated things that she had been told before about trusting Jesus.  I knew I didn't have a lot of time for a detailed gospel presentation.  Long story short, she said to me that she trusted Jesus and believed that He had died for her.  So I told her that she was probably seeing demons and asked her if that was true, and she said yes.  I took authority over them and told them they had to leave, and they did.  She was peaceful after that until her death.  She saw heaven, my father and little brothers who had died.  My sister-in-law asked her if God was there, and she said yes, God was there.  She said it was beautiful.  I was very thankful that the things she was seeing had changed and she didn't seem afraid to die anymore.  Then she told her pastor that she was ready to die.  Later, she saw an angel in her room. 

Where was I going with this story?  I saw things and felt things that month that I'd never felt before.  I felt God's nearness, heaven's nearness, like I never had.  I felt the spirit world's nearness like I never have before.  Since then, since the repressed grief about my husband has surfaced, I have sensed him around me.  I never had before.  I have sensed him speaking to me, telling me I had to live, that it wasn't time for me to die (because I very much wanted to die and be with him), telling me that he was praying for me.  The passage in Hebrews about the "cloud of witnesses" I believe could include those who have died and are now in Heaven.  I've always believed it was the angels, but I now believe it is Christians or believers in Jesus, also.  That passage hints that they do know something of things that are happening in our lives and may actually be praying for us to be able to "finish the race" and please God by our lives. 

I agree with all of you that I couldn't have made it through this time of mourning and grief without the strength of the Lord.  He has carried me when I could no longer walk.  He has reached into the pit of despair and pulled me out by His own strength because I had none to offer.  That's why I love Psalm 13 so much, which I quoted a few days ago. 

So, these are the thoughts I had as I was reading your posts... just my two cents' worth. 

Under His Mercy,

Oneta

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4everjoeysmom

I think the Cloud of Witness does include people in Heaven. gone before us--and maybe even more specifically after studying that a little bit more, the "martyrs", the saints of the old testament that definitely suffered for the cause of Christ, who were in great numbers, compared to the covering like a cloud.  They are definitely an example to encouarge us to lay aside every encumberance and heed warnings to the things of this world seducing our minds over Christ, or the painful circumstances of life and despair thereof swallowing us up in defeat.  Interesting to meditate on....

Most of Revelation is accounted by John as a "vision" God gave him, where he saw many things of heaven.  Whether it was by dream or trance or whatever...  indeed God speaks to us in dreams and visions.

Oneta, that is an awesome testimony about your mom, her visions, her claiming victory in jesus, (and of course you binding the demons and taking authority in jesus' name to dispell their presence) and her peaceful passing into eternal life with Him.  I've heard amazing things like that countless times, and it always makes my hair stand up at the back of my neck with excitement.  It is said in the Word that our fight is against principalities, (as in the world itself not being our major battle), but it's so hard to know sometimes what is our human nature screaming for what we carnally desire and what is of the spirit realm tempting us.  It's why its so important, as Hebrews exhorts over and over again, to remain steadfast in Christ.  Thanks SO MUCH for sharing that awesome testimony.  I can only imagine how much that heightened your awareness to the spirit realm.

PATTI!!!    YAY for you!!!!!!!!!!!  I cannot even begin to tell you how my heart is dancing in reading your post.  I love NC!!  I lived there for 8 years before leaving for Ecuador (originally from the midwest).  What part are you working in?  And I am so happy to hear that there is a new burst of confidence being born in you.  I am thankful that God gives us the wisdom and grace to share what He does for us with others so that things like what are happening for you can become reality for others.  Let us know how it goes the second week when you can.  I hope you had fun shopping for some new clothes too.  I know its hard when its because of weight gain, but considering all you've been through, and now having the growing confidence to become engaged again in activity, you'll be able to feel better and better about yourself and life along the way.  It's baby steps for a while, and sometimes a few steps back and one forward, but in time the steps forward become greater.  Good job!!  I'm so happy for you and proud of you too!!!!!!!!!  HUGS, Claudia

 

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Oneta what a beautiful story!  i believe every word you said.. My mom also before she died was in and out of it and i said to her do you see grandpa & uncle John etc and she said yes i do and i said do you see angels and i think she said yes. she was at peace. but then a few days before she finally died, she was ill like this in and out of it for about a week with about maybe 1 day of being sort of with it a tiny bit.

and about a day or 2 before she died she looked so sad and like begging for help. she looked so sad i just hope that demons werent trying to harass her to. i prayed over her and turned on the rosary on cd in her room.we are both catholic. the rosary were being said by mother angelica and her nuns, they are very holy, prayerful people. that seemed to help her a lot. the whole time she was ill like that i kept playing the rosary & kept it on repeat all the time, till she died and then even after that i kept it playing in her room for quite a bit.

many times at late night and during the 1 am etc hours the nurse would go in to my moms room and see her mouthing the words to the rosary that mother angelica was saying. that was quite amazing bc mom couldnt any longer talk at all and was way out of it. so for her to be able to even do that was amazing. it just shows how much she loved to pray.

i was so proud to be able to that for her with her mother anglica cd, so she would never feel alone ever.

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Patti:  I, too, am so thankful that you have been able to get back out "into the world", despite how you may feel inside.  It is a victory just to be able to do what we fear.   You will get better and better at being able to have victory through Jesus over life's circumstances, and God's voice will grow louder than Satan's.  It just takes a little practice, like most everything in life.   Happy the things we say (evidently not even aimed at that when we say them) help you to do that.

Claudia:  I agree that part of the "cloud of witnesses" includes the martyrs.  I have always thought how prividedged we are to be able to benefit from their prayers - them, of all people, who did as Jim Elliott said, gave what they could never keep to gain what they could never lose.  I don't tell just anyone that story about my mother.  Some people really would think I had completely lost it.  I didn't even tell my brother because I knew he wouldn't see it for what it was.  It's time the Church learns how to take authority over the Enemy.  The night it was happening, all I could think wa, "My mother is dying and going to hell!  I can't let that happen!"  I just sort of "jumped in", and I guess God just took over.

Sheela:  I have no doubts that playing the rosary like you did caused Satan to flee.  I didn't know that you could get the rosary on tape or Cd (not being Catholic), but I'm not surprised.   You can get almost anything that way anymore.  There have been many times when I've played praise music like you did the rosary.  Prayer is prayer.  Satan hates it.  I'm sure the demons didn't care to stick around long when they heard it. 

Gotta get to bed.  Good conversation.  Love to all of you and anyone else stopping in to read.  ~Oneta

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Hello Everyone!

 

Thank you so much for the prayers on Friday.  It was my second Friday night back at my part-time job without Danielle (she worked there also).  I heard many stories about Danielle and how much she meant to her customers and witnessed to them about Jesus and his love for them.  One of our customers from the restuarant assistanted in her funeral.  She was such a joy to everyone around her.  Of course her preacher, preached the service but it meant alot to me to have one of her customers help with her service.  How many 21 year old know and talk with 2 preachers on a weekly basis?  How I miss her so much. 

 

Patti,  (Big Mike's Mom)

I'm so very proud of you being able to get back to work and shopping.  I was only able to took a week off from my primary job when Danielle passed away.  I live in NC!!  Burlington, NC which is close to Greensboro, if you are near by please let me know I would like to meet for lunch or coffee.

To Everyone on this Thread

May God bless and keep you near and dear to his heart.  You will never know just how much you have meant to me during this terrible time of loss.  

I think I'm getting long winded, but I have told so many people about each of you and I have asked them to pray for each of you and your losses.

Prayers

Sonya (Danielle's Mom)  

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loveyoujustin

HI everyone!  It's Trish.  It's been a tough night, but i just wanted to say "God Bless You, and I love you, and am thinking of and Praying, yes, I am praying, for all of you, my dear friends.  Peace and Love.

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Sonia you are doing so well and showing such courage  to return to the  place where you and Danielle worked together.The pain is "right in your face" and in public view at times like this.I hope you find more strength each time you do it and I am absolutely certain God will honour it, and use you in a very special way.

Trish, I have recently been back again to Justin's memorial page, I don't quite know why but I just want you to know I enjoy looking at it- if that's the right word! What a lovely lovely lad he was, my heart aches for you and your family.

As for me, well I can't face church again this morning so my husband has gone alone.(it's Sunday morning here in the UK)He finds it harder himself when I'm not there, because when I am struggling he looks after me and puts his own pain to one side, but when he goes alone he has to face his own painful thoughts and memories. I will have my own quiet time of worship and contemplation, and I'm going to try and be quiet more to try and hear what God is saying to me.My head is so full of painful thoughts and images a turmoil of emotions, I believe  need to find a space to allow God back in.Does that make sense?

May I ask you wise guys a questions please? While I am able to accept that God did not "take" my Jamie away in that terrible car crash,and it is not what God wanted or planned for his life, I am struggling that with the troubling thought that God could so easily have prevented this tragedy.If the car even landed an inch either way he would have survived. I guess we can all ask the same question, but I just wondered how you all feel about this and if you have settled it in your own minds as to why God did not intervene and save our darlings.

Love in Him

Anne

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4everjoeysmom

Trish, I am praying for you too.  I hope today brings a special blessing of comfort and peace for you.

Sonya, Thanks for sharing your evening at the restaurant.  You are so precious, and I know God is giving you extra strength to do what you are doing.  I tried to envision the young customer standing with the preachers.  It's a nice image, because God gives wisdom to His children, and we don't necessarily have to be ordained in the eyes of people to receive it.  She sounds like she has a true gift.

Anne, That's a tough question that I think all of us ask God.  Why didn't He intervene?  The only way I know how to even address that is by what God showed me along my journey and in the midst of my own questions in those early months.

As we live here (on Earth) we tend to get very comfortable and forget that we were made to be eternal creatures.  We were made specifically for God's pleasure and for His glory.  We were made to be in eternal fellowship with Him.  Scripture says in

1Co 13:12 For now we see in a mirror dimly, but then face to face; now I know in part, but then I will know fully just as I also have been fully known.

I believe this face to face with Jesus, living in perfect fellowship with Him, in Heaven and eventually on a New Earth, without sin or temptation or distractions from the full and perfect worship, without pride and struggle, but fully perfected (glorified like Him) in His presence, THIS is what we truly are meant to have.  Our lives here are temporal and maybe even a training camp to learn through adversities to be mor elike Him.  We, His Children, tend to forget that and center ourselves in our lives, families, careers, circumstances and blessings of life here.  We forget that there is a life far beyond this one that reflects dimly in a mirror, and that there is a better life, a better hope (as Hebrews describes so fully), one in which we will see clearly the fullness and glory of God, and we will adore and praise Him so completely.  That is what we were made to do.

So, God showed me this, through study in His Word and through whispers to my heart, and I fully realized how beautiful it must be for Joey to be there.  Of course I miss Him and I carry a secret desire that God would have intervened, that Joey were still here and mine, but Joey truly does not think or desire any of that at this point.  He is in the FULLNESS of what he was ultimately created for.  And it is there that I long to be too, one day, when God has chosen for me to go home to my Fullness of eternal life and glory in His presence.

It is we who desire and long for our beloveds to be here with us, because we are still in the world.  But I assure you, in the presence of God and seeing clearly, they are exactly where they should be.  It hurts for us.  It will hurt for us until the day we go home too.  But if we can think about our beloveds truly being in the fullness of why they were made to exist in the first place, it of opens up a new perspective, to an eternal way of thinking.  And I believe this is a gift from God to us beyond the loss of our beloveds.

There are lots of other "hints" we can pick up on along the way to show us how the entry into eternal life that our loved ones have made have glorified God.  For me, others came to Christ through losing Joey.  Joey's story has been shared with hundreds here where I work, and many have prayed to have eternal life like Joey when their time here is done--many young people.  That's an amazing thing to see, how whatever was meant for evil in this world, including perhaps some of the circumstances in Joey's death, how it all is being turned for good, because I do love God and I am called according to His purpose.

It's longer winded than I had wanted to write, but it's hard to keep short the sharing of a beautiful Lord who has instead of intervening and doing what we want, continues weaving a beautiful tapestry in which we are a part of and one day will be perfected to completion.  Blessings, Claudia

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