Inconsiderate things you've heard while grieving by people trying to ''help''?

[FirstWasLast]

About cancer, and it being ''above all a mental struggle, where your will to live defines your survival''.

About me being young, and therefore ''I'll find someone else''.

About him being ''only a partner'', therefore replaceable, and nothing like the loss of a parent or child.

And many more I'll surely remember later...

[Ka9219]

"You are so pretty, I know you will find someone else"

"He was just your boyfriend, dont worry you will recover soon"

"Only 8 months? Why are grieving so deeply?"

"If you cry you wont let him rest in peace"

"Mario is dead, MOVE ON!!!"

[Francine]

It's so easy to give advice when you have not gone through it.  Sometimes words can hurt more than physical pain.   The tongue is a small thing, but what enormous damage it can do.  People should  taste their words and think before spitting them out.  Try not to let people's words or inadequate use of them get to your head; I know people can be mean, selfish, and hurtful and I know some people have bad intentions. However, I also know that sometimes well-intentioned people say the wrong thing but whose heart is in the right place. 

[FirstWasLast]

1 hour ago, Ka9219 said:

"If you cry you wont let him rest in peace"

Oh my god, yes! That's what my mom told me, just one month after his passing, about me staying at home most of the time and wearing black.

[FirstWasLast]

33 minutes ago, Francine said:

It's so easy to give advice when you have not gone through it.  Sometimes words can hurt more than physical pain.   The tongue is a small thing, but what enormous damage it can do.  People should  taste their words and think before spitting them out.  Try not to let people's words or inadequate use of them get to your head; I know people can be mean, selfish, and hurtful and I know some people have bad intentions. However, I also know that sometimes well-intentioned people say the wrong thing but whose heart is in the right place. 

You are very right, and I do try to just ignore hurtful things that are being said. But sometimes I just can't. And people need to realise that there's nothing they can say, especially if you didn't ask them.

[KMB]

The worst I've heard is " You may be in your late 50's, but you are so young looking yet. You should be out dating and having fun. You only live once"!

My life. I will do with it what I choose. I choose to wait to be reunited with my husband.

[Francine]

15 minutes ago, KMB said:

The worst I've heard is " You may be in your late 50's, but you are so young looking yet. You should be out dating and having fun. You only live once"!

My life. I will do with it what I choose. I choose to wait to be reunited with my husband.

Right on KMB.  I've even got the line, "Sixty? You still got it going on"  - are they freaking *NUTS*   Like you, there is absolutely nothing, and I mean NOTHING out there that I want.
Charles and I shared a love that will last a lifetime and once we are reunited again, we will pick it up where we left off (in a different way) but only this time, it will be for eternity. 

[Dian]

I've been told if it makes you feel sick inside when you think of him then don't think of him! Really??? 

[KylieL]

The worst one for me is "you will find a better one." 

My mom said it, not just once. I explained that he didn't break up with me, but she still keep saying that. I don't know why but she probably means someone that won't pass away so young and leave her daughter. I feel angry every time I hear that. My boyfriend did nothing wrong, he didn't choose to die, and I will never find a "better" one because he's the perfect one for me. I know my mom is trying to comfort me but she keep saying the wrong thing and it hurts. 

[Ka9219]

2 hours ago, KylieL said:

"you will find a better one." 

I've heard that one too, worst is that I burst in tears and the person who was telling me so started to apologize. Sometimes people try to say something in order to help but I think sometimes, a hug, holding a hand is better than a word, there is nothing that could be said that make us feel better.

[FirstWasLast]

6 minutes ago, Ka9219 said:

I've heard that one too, worst is that I burst in tears and the person who was telling me so started to apologize. Sometimes people try to say something in order to help but I think sometimes, a hug, holding a hand is better than a word, there is nothing that could be said that make us feel better.

The best comfort I ever got was from a dog. I was in my partner's village for his funeral, staying over at his cousin's house who had this huge, fluffy white dog. Well, this dog knew exactly when I was crying, and he'd come in my room and just stay with me and lick my legs until I stopped crying. 

My point is, and this is what I've told a few people I trust, in this situation, the best attitude you can have with someone grieving is that of a dog: just be there and don't feel the need to say anything.

[Ka9219]

2 hours ago, FirstWasLast said:

the best attitude you can have with someone grieving is that of a dog: just be there and don't feel the need to say anything.

I couldn't agreed more! 

[KayC]

7 hours ago, FirstWasLast said:

the best attitude you can have with someone grieving is that of a dog: just be there and don't feel the need to say anything.

That is so true!  Don't feel the need to have diarrhea of the mouth, just be there.  We can learn a lot from dogs, I personally feel they are God's greatest blessing to us.

[KayC]

What Is Not Helpful to the Person in Mourning: A List of "Donts"
 

•  Be aware of what is not helpful to the person in mourning. 

 Do not: ·        

•           Expect your friend to mourn or heal in certain ways or within a certain time frame.
• ·         Deliberately avoid the subject of death, change the subject, or act as if nothing has happened.
• ·         Talk about your own losses, especially early on; this shifts the attention onto you.
• ·         Use judgmental words like “should” and “shouldn’t.”
• ·         Begin a sentence with the words “At least . . .”
• ·         Offer unsolicited advice.
• ·         Compare one loss with another, or offer judgments about which loss was worse.
• ·         Take it personally if your friend rebuffs your invitations.  Try again another day, and realize that grief requires being left alone at times.                 The mourner needs some time to turn inward, to ponder the deeper meaning of life and death.
• ·         Try to change what your friend is thinking or feeling.
• ·         Talk down to the person, in a patronizing way, as if you are the expert.
• ·         Try to fill up every moment with conversation.  Become comfortable with silence.
• ·         Ignore warning signs of self-destructive behavior: alcohol, drugs, depression, suicide. Confront the person directly, or organize an                       intervention with family and friends.
• ·         Wait for your friend to initiate contact (i.e., call, write or visit).
• ·         Wait until tomorrow or make promises you cannot (or will not) keep.  Follow through with whatever you have planned or promised.
• ·         Wait to be asked; this places the burden on the mourner.
• ·         Expect gratitude for your efforts.  A person in pain is focused inward and self- absorbed, with little room for gratitude.  If you offer help,               make sure that it is wanted, and don’t feel hurt or rejected if it is not.
• ·         Push or expect the mourner to sort through and distribute a loved one’s things.
• ·         Take away the mourner’s autonomy by doing too much for her or making major decisions that rightfully belong to her.
• ·         Expect the mourner to begin to reenter social life on other than his/her own time frame.
• ·         Try to rescue someone from her regrets; she needs time to sort them out, until she is eventually able to forgive herself.
• ·         Force food on the person if he is not interested in eating.
• ·         Expect the mourner to be over it within weeks, months or even years.
• ·         Try to do everything by yourself, or try to fix everything.
•  

Copyright © by Martha M. Tousley, RN, MS, FT, DCC    All rights reserved

[KayC]

Helpful-NOT!.docx (attached because of formatting issues)

 

What Is Not Helpful to the Person in Mourning: A List of "Donts"
 

 Be aware of what is not helpful to the person in mourning. 

 Do not:

·         Expect your friend to mourn or heal in certain ways or within a certain time frame.

·         Deliberately avoid the subject of death, change the subject, or act as if nothing has happened.

·         Talk about your own losses, especially early on; this shifts the attention onto you.

·         Use judgmental words like “should” and “shouldn’t.”

·         Begin a sentence with the words “At least . . .”

·         Offer unsolicited advice.

·         Compare one loss with another, or offer judgments about which loss was worse.

·         Take it personally if your friend rebuffs your invitations.  Try again another day, and realize that grief requires being left alone at times.  The mourner needs some time to turn inward, to ponder the deeper meaning of life and death.

·         Try to change what your friend is thinking or feeling.

·         Talk down to the person, in a patronizing way, as if you are the expert.

·         Try to fill up every moment with conversation.  Become comfortable with silence.

·         Ignore warning signs of self-destructive behavior: alcohol, drugs, depression, suicide. Confront the person directly, or organize an intervention with family and friends.

·         Wait for your friend to initiate contact (i.e., call, write or visit).

·         Wait until tomorrow or make promises you cannot (or will not) keep.  Follow through with whatever you have planned or promised.

·         Wait to be asked; this places the burden on the mourner.

·         Expect gratitude for your efforts.  A person in pain is focused inward and self- absorbed, with little room for gratitude.  If you offer help, make sure that it is wanted, and don’t feel hurt or rejected if it is not.

·         Push or expect the mourner to sort through and distribute a loved one’s things.

·         Take away the mourner’s autonomy by doing too much for her or making major decisions that rightfully belong to her.

·         Expect the mourner to begin to reenter social life on other than his/her own time frame.

·         Try to rescue someone from her regrets; she needs time to sort them out, until she is eventually able to forgive herself.

·         Force food on the person if he is not interested in eating.

·         Expect the mourner to be over it within weeks, months or even years.

·         Try to do everything by yourself, or try to fix everything.

 

Copyright © by Martha M. Tousley, RN, MS, FT, DCC    All rights reserved

 

 

[FirstWasLast]

2 hours ago, KayC said:

That is so true!  Don't feel the need to have diarrhea of the mouth, just be there.  We can learn a lot from dogs, I personally feel they are God's greatest blessing to us.

Me too and I wish I had one! This particular dog I mentioned blew me away, he would come EVERY TIME I cried, even though it was behind closed doors and silently. And he'd lick my legs and hands and face until I felt better. And the truth is, I did!

[FirstWasLast]

2 hours ago, KayC said:

What Is Not Helpful to the Person in Mourning: A List of "Donts"
 

•  Be aware of what is not helpful to the person in mourning. 

 Do not: ·        

•           Expect your friend to mourn or heal in certain ways or within a certain time frame.
• ·         Deliberately avoid the subject of death, change the subject, or act as if nothing has happened.
• ·         Talk about your own losses, especially early on; this shifts the attention onto you.
• ·         Use judgmental words like “should” and “shouldn’t.”
• ·         Begin a sentence with the words “At least . . .”
• ·         Offer unsolicited advice.
• ·         Compare one loss with another, or offer judgments about which loss was worse.
• ·         Take it personally if your friend rebuffs your invitations.  Try again another day, and realize that grief requires being left alone at times.                 The mourner needs some time to turn inward, to ponder the deeper meaning of life and death.
• ·         Try to change what your friend is thinking or feeling.
• ·         Talk down to the person, in a patronizing way, as if you are the expert.
• ·         Try to fill up every moment with conversation.  Become comfortable with silence.
• ·         Ignore warning signs of self-destructive behavior: alcohol, drugs, depression, suicide. Confront the person directly, or organize an                       intervention with family and friends.
• ·         Wait for your friend to initiate contact (i.e., call, write or visit).
• ·         Wait until tomorrow or make promises you cannot (or will not) keep.  Follow through with whatever you have planned or promised.
• ·         Wait to be asked; this places the burden on the mourner.
• ·         Expect gratitude for your efforts.  A person in pain is focused inward and self- absorbed, with little room for gratitude.  If you offer help,               make sure that it is wanted, and don’t feel hurt or rejected if it is not.
• ·         Push or expect the mourner to sort through and distribute a loved one’s things.
• ·         Take away the mourner’s autonomy by doing too much for her or making major decisions that rightfully belong to her.
• ·         Expect the mourner to begin to reenter social life on other than his/her own time frame.
• ·         Try to rescue someone from her regrets; she needs time to sort them out, until she is eventually able to forgive herself.
• ·         Force food on the person if he is not interested in eating.
• ·         Expect the mourner to be over it within weeks, months or even years.
• ·         Try to do everything by yourself, or try to fix everything.
•  

Copyright © by Martha M. Tousley, RN, MS, FT, DCC    All rights reserved

Oh my, almost every single point describes my mother's behaviour after I lost my partner... No wonder our relationship is more strained than ever.

Also, this list is very very accurate. Thank you so much for posting.

[KMB]

Personally, I feel this list should be printed on a deceased person's memorial/funeral services handout. Maybe, it would give a person pause before speaking to the bereaved.

Even the most well intended need to think of their words before saying them.

[AlwaysDee]

the cliches get me...

"everything happens for a reason"

"when one door closes another opens"

"This was Gods will/Gods plan"

"It was his time"

And maybe it was his time, but I don't want to hear it! I don't want to hear your stupid cliche remarks. I don't think this was Gods plan. I don't think God causes suffering, I think hes there to comfort us when horrible things happen but I don't think he brought us together and then ripped us apart in some sort of sick twisted lesson hes trying to teach me.

I also hate the questions. I don't know if its morbid curiosity, genuine concern, or the fact that they don't know what to say so they get nosy?

"Have you been home?"

"When will you go home? I'll go with you when you go" 

"Why haven't you gone home?"

"Guess you'll have to find a job now huh?"

"Will you be able to pay your bills?"

"Will you keep living in your house?"

"Have you heard from toxicology/coroner?"

"How are you doing?" ....Oh you know, hanging in there... "No really, how are you doing."  ...uhm I'm hanging in there... "really...?"            Damn! get off my case did you just get out of a college psychology course??? what do you want from me? I'm a wreck? I dont sleep at night? I just cried in the bathroom at the applebees? What level of grief do I need to tell you I'm at for you to stop tilting your head to the side, giving me so much eye contact and saying "really?"  ?!

anyways... I try really hard not to think negatively. My friend said people dont know how to handle me and they are doing their best... I get it. I'm polite, I thank people for asking about me... But really, like everyone else has said, Just being there for me has been the best anyone has done. Helping me with paperwork and answering my texts...letting me sit on your couch bc im lonely (and dont expect to be entertained I just want to not be alone.) I don't need or expect anyone to say anything that's going to make me feel better.

 

 

[Djh0901kc]

14 minutes ago, AlwaysDee said:

 

"Have you been home?"

"When will you go home? I'll go with you when you go" 

"Why haven't you gone home?"

 

 

I heard this enough that I finally snapped out. " Because it's an empty house full of nothing but sadness. If I go home you'll end up finding my body." Ended the questions.

[Djh0901kc]

I also can't stand hearing that it was my wife's time. The day before her 35th birthday? No. Sorry. It wasn't her time. I'll never buy that.

[FirstWasLast]

16 minutes ago, AlwaysDee said:

"everything happens for a reason"

This phrase makes me want to set myself on fire. I'm guilty of using it in the past. Not referring to someone's death, but in general. I had this romantic/naive perception of life that one has when nothing really bad has happened to them and they just believe that everything is magically connected and planned, that life is fair and justice is being served eventually to those who deserve it. Since the love of my life died, I can't believe I ever thought this kind of nonsense was real. If anything, his death gave me a painful kind of lucidity: nothing happens for a reason, because there is no reason, everything is random and so nothing is worth the fuss. ''Everything happens for a reason'' implies that there is a reason my heart is being ripped apart and my life has lost all its meaning, like I deserve it or like all this is a lesson. Surprise: it's not.

Also, the ''how are you doing'' is something that really baffled me at the beginning. You know how when people see you or call you and automatically ask -without thinking, obviously- ''hi, how are you doing?''. They're just being polite, it's a mindless question really, basic human communication, just like the answer ''fine'', whether you really are fine or not. But at the beginning, I just couldn't. I simply couldn't answer, that question seemed so out of place to me. If I was in a really bad day, I'd even reply ''well, how do you think I'm doing?''. Sometimes I'd be honest and say ''not well'', but the problem with that answer is that it's an invitation to more questions and conversation that supposedly leads to a solution, whereas in my case there was no solution. I wasn't well, but that was a reality, not a state, so there was no discussion to be made, nor a solution to be found. For that reason, I've lately forced myself to simply go back to the ''I'm fine'' option.

[FirstWasLast]

12 minutes ago, Djh0901kc said:

I also can't stand hearing that it was my wife's time. The day before her 35th birthday? No. Sorry. It wasn't her time. I'll never buy that.

The day before her birthday? Gosh, that's violent... My partner died 3 days before my birthday. Safe to say I won't be celebrating it ever again.

[AshleyDonahue]

18 hours ago, KylieL said:

The worst one for me is "you will find a better one." 

That is awful; I'm so sorry. My mom, my friends and surprisingly even my therapist have made comments about meeting someone new, loving again, etc... and I always find those to be the most hurtful. But "better"? Ugh, that takes the cake. 

Some of the gems I've heard... 

- "He wouldn't have wanted to live with the injuries he sustained"

Well, now maybe I'm being selfish, but I just want him here, alive, with me. I don't care how different or challenging our life would have been... we could have done it, if we were together. And I don't really think that was his "choice" to make. 

- "He will send someone new to you"

Goes back to the whole meeting someone new thing, but I remember this idea/comment in particular bothering me immensely.

- "He wouldn't want you to be sad/hurting/he wouldn't want to see you like this"

Get this one a lot, double whammy because IMO it vastly oversimplifies the situation and also makes me feel guilty, like I am somehow failing him.

- "I looked into the process for removing him for your joint accounts, you just need to bring the death certificate into a Chase bank and it will be very easy"

Oh, how wonderful and convenient! As if I would ever take his name off of anything that we shared. 

[KMB]

17 minutes ago, FirstWasLast said:

Safe to say I won't be celebrating it ever again.

Same here. My husband passed 3 weeks before my birthday. He was planning on us going out to dinner.  What he did for me every year. He didn't plan on dying, that I know for sure. Last year, I didn't remember it was my birthday until later that night and I cried because he wasn't here for me. This year will be no different.

[AshleyDonahue]

Oh, and this one is similar to one of the items from Kay's post, regarding comparing one loss to another... but I've actually had a few people bring up their divorce as a point of reference.

Not. The. Same. 

[KMB]

Yes, comparing our loss takes the cake in reference to a divorce.  Divorce is a loss, but it is not a permanent deletion of physical absence from this earth. Divorced spouses can still see and talk to each other. Some are still involved in each others lives due to children or just recognize they get along better not being married. Not the same as you say!

[FirstWasLast]

32 minutes ago, AshleyDonahue said:

"He wouldn't want you to be sad/hurting/he wouldn't want to see you like this"

Yeah, I get that a lot too. It's usually an argument used by people to motivate you to move on ''for him'', but it just doesn't work. People around me have used it to talk me out of wearing black, not using make up anymore, mostly staying in, refusing to go out with friends, not talking... And the list goes on. But the thing is, even if he does see me -I'm not sure yet if I believe that or not- and is saddened by my behaviour, I can't do anything about it. I do everything I can to feel at least a little more comfortable, so if he's not okay with any of that...for once in my life, I don't care. And I sure as hell won't accept to feel guilty or shamed about how a dead person would feel about the ways I choose to cope with my loss!

[FirstWasLast]

10 minutes ago, KMB said:

Yes, comparing our loss takes the cake in reference to a divorce.  Divorce is a loss, but it is not a permanent deletion of physical absence from this earth. Divorced spouses can still see and talk to each other. Some are still involved in each others lives due to children or just recognize they get along better not being married. Not the same as you say!

It makes me furious. I've actually heard ''divorce is like a small death...perhaps even worse than death''. I've also heard the same about a breakup after a long-term relationship.

Why? Just, why would anyone consider a separation to be remotely similar to dying? Or even worse? Because of the rejection? Because a dead person didn't stop loving you, but rather stopped existing altogether? Words fail to express how this comparison angers me. It's NOT the same. Even after a nasty divorce or breakup, where the other person doesn't want to see you or speak to you, if you absolutely need to see them, simply because you're still not over them and want to look at their face again, well guess what, you can. I can't. The only way for me to see my partner is motionless photos, and the same old voice messages to hear his voice. I can't believe someone would find it ok to say something like that. Think it if you want, but keep it to yourself.

[FirstWasLast]

I also can't accept the ''I know how you feel'' reaction coming from people who haven't lost a partner. No, you don't know how I feel. You can perhaps vaguely imagine it in a very theoretical way, but you certainly don't know.

[AshleyDonahue]

12 minutes ago, FirstWasLast said:

Yeah, I get that a lot too. It's usually an argument used by people to motivate you to move on ''for him'', but it just doesn't work. People around me have used it to talk me out of wearing black, not using make up anymore, mostly staying in, refusing to go out with friends, not talking... And the list goes on. But the thing is, even if he does see me -I'm not sure yet if I believe that or not- and is saddened by my behaviour, I can't do anything about it. I do everything I can to feel at least a little more comfortable, so if he's not okay with any of that...for once in my life, I don't care. And I sure as hell won't accept to feel guilty or shamed about how a dead person would feel about the ways I choose to cope with my loss!

I am in the same boat right now, I have really been struggling lately with whether or not he can see me... not to go too far off-topic with religion, but I have such a hard time trying to reconcile the concept of awareness in the afterlife... I've always been told that there is no hurting or feelings of pain in heaven. And while I'd obviously like to believe that is true, and that David is not suffering at all... if that's the case, then how can he also be "with me" or watching me, and seeing me in so much pain? Because surely that would upset him, so does that mean he isn't witnessing what's going on down here in earth? Either scenario upsets me, so I usually just have to push the whole thought process out of my mind. 

I digress... I can relate to other part of your message too. I haven't been wearing black, but most days I just wear one of his XL t-shirts, and I definitely don't bother with make up anymore. The few times I've forced myself to "put myself together" to some extent - like for my sisters wedding and rehearsal dinner - everyone makes a big, ridiculous fuss about how "nice" I look, in contrast to the worried looks I get the rest of the time. I know they're trying to be encouraging, but... it just doesn't help or change anything. 

I even had a friend question if/when I'm going to take off my engagement ring or move it to another hand. Maybe it's still all just too soon, but from where I stand now, I have no intention of ever moving it. 

[AshleyDonahue]

49 minutes ago, KMB said:

Yes, comparing our loss takes the cake in reference to a divorce.  Divorce is a loss, but it is not a permanent deletion of physical absence from this earth. Divorced spouses can still see and talk to each other. Some are still involved in each others lives due to children or just recognize they get along better not being married. Not the same as you say!

Yes to all of this! I am sure divorce is awful, some divorces even more so than others, and I certainly don't want to minimize the pain people have gone through in those situations. But in those cases, aren't the people generally feeling mad or disappointed with their ex? To have a relationship end can be painful, but to lose someone who you are very much still in love with, and they are very much still in love with you... it's completely different and unfair (I know I sound like a child lately, for how often I use the word "unfair", but it just plain is). I can't fathom a reason or time that David and I would have ever separated, but I would prefer that any day to his passing. At least he would still be here, and I'd find some comfort in knowing he was walking and breathing on this earth, and there was some chance of being reunited again. 

[FirstWasLast]

14 minutes ago, AshleyDonahue said:

How can he also be "with me" or watching me, and seeing me in so much pain? Because surely that would upset him, so does that mean he isn't witnessing what's going on down here in earth?

I'm not religious at all so my interpretation comes from a different perspective, but what you wrote corresponds exactly to my thoughts. It'll soon be 4 months since I lost him, and he still hasn't visited me in my dream. I've lost dear people before who then visited me in my dream. I could just feel that it was actually them and not a random dream about them. Now, here's the problem: if dead people can visit in my dream, it means they still exist somewhere, somehow, right? But why won't my partner visit me if he sees how I am? I had started a topic about that exact matter, and some people said that it can take some time for visitation dreams to occur and there are many explanations, so basically you pick the one that makes you feel better. While I don't exclude that he will eventually visit, my beliefs are deeply shaken. No other death has devastated me more than his, so everything I once believed in is being doubted. Now, I tend to believe that perhaps visitation dreams aren't a thing, or maybe he can't see yet what's going on down here, all that for a simple reason: I KNOW that if he did see me and how miserable and desperate I am, he would communicate with me and give me some comfort. There's no way he or David would be indifferent to that. So, either they can't do it yet, or can't do it at all, or they can't see what's going on in this world, or simply, they have stopped existing altogether.

Quote

The few times I've forced myself to "put myself together" to some extent - like for my sisters wedding and rehearsal dinner - everyone makes a big, ridiculous fuss about how "nice" I look, in contrast to the worried looks I get the rest of the time. I know they're trying to be encouraging, but... it just doesn't help or change anything. 

Tell me about the fuss... Every time I see friends, the first thing they say is how beautiful I look, whether I've made an effort or not, and usually in a way too exaggerated tone. They only mean well, I know that, but even if I do look beautiful, I don't care. He's not here to see it, so I couldn't care less. Also, another thing about makeup: when I occasionally made the effort to put it on, I just felt like a clown trying to disguise their sadness behind a ridiculous artifice.

Quote

I even had a friend question if/when I'm going to take off my engagement ring or move it to another hand. Maybe it's still all just too soon, but from where I stand now, I have no intention of ever moving it. 

By all means, keep it on as long as you need to. But here's an idea that you may or may not find interesting: since objects can get lost, damaged or stolen, I got a tattoo of my partner's initials on the inner side of my left ring finger. It's incredibly discreet, I'm the only one to see it and he's literally part of my body in a way, forever. Plus, I had the tattoo artist copy his handwriting from one of the poems he had written for me, so that's an extra element that makes it even more intimate. And I can always wear a ring with that if I want.

[FirstWasLast]

14 minutes ago, AshleyDonahue said:

Yes to all of this! I am sure divorce is awful, some divorces even more so than others, and I certainly don't want to minimize the pain people have gone through in those situations. But in those cases, aren't the people generally feeling mad or disappointed with their ex? To have a relationship end can be painful, but to lose someone who you are very much still in love with, and they are very much still in love with you... it's completely different and unfair (I know I sound like a child lately, for how often I use the word "unfair", but it just plain is). I can't fathom a reason or time that David and I would have ever separated, but I would prefer that any day to his passing. At least he would still be here, and I'd find some comfort in knowing he was walking and breathing on this earth, and there was some chance of being reunited again. 

I guess people say that about divorce because it's uncommon that both parties feel exactly the same way. To put it bluntly, one person does the dumping and the other one gets. dumped. In that case, what stings is rejection, which is undoubtedly a very harsh thing. So these people may see death as something better because in a romantic and naive conception of things, this love never wore away or ended, it just became eternal. But that's typically what you'd think if you just imagined the death of a partner, not if you had experienced it. Besides, a huge handicap this death leaves you with is idealisation. We lose our love so suddenly that they become divine in our memory, no one compares to them. That's a huge obstacle in moving on, which I sincerely don't know how -or if- I'll overcome. Whereas when someone breaks up with you, you get the chance to see them in another, less ideal light.

[AshleyDonahue]

10 minutes ago, FirstWasLast said:

I'm not religious at all so my interpretation comes from a different perspective, but what you wrote corresponds exactly to my thoughts. It'll soon be 4 months since I lost him, and he still hasn't visited me in my dream. I've lost dear people before who then visited me in my dream. I could just feel that it was actually them and not a random dream about them. Now, here's the problem: if dead people can visit in my dream, it means they still exist somewhere, somehow, right? But why won't my partner visit me if he sees how I am? I had started a topic about that exact matter, and some people said that it can take some time for visitation dreams to occur and there are many explanations, so basically you pick the one that makes you feel better. While I don't exclude that he will eventually visit, my beliefs are deeply shaken. No other death has devastated me more than his, so everything I once believed in is being doubted. Now, I tend to believe that perhaps visitation dreams aren't a thing, or maybe he can't see yet what's going on down here, all that for a simple reason: I KNOW that if he did see me and how miserable and desperate I am, he would communicate with me and give me some comfort. There's no way he or David would be indifferent to that. So, either they can't do it yet, or can't do it at all, or they can't see what's going on in this world, or simply, they have stopped existing altogether.

Tell me about the fuss... Every time I see friends, the first thing they say is how beautiful I look, whether I've made an effort or not, and usually in a way too exaggerated tone. They only mean well, I know that, but even if I do look beautiful, I don't care. He's not here to see it, so I couldn't care less. Also, another thing about makeup: when I occasionally made the effort to put it on, I just felt like a clown trying to disguise their sadness behind a ridiculous artifice.

By all means, keep it on as long as you need to. But here's an idea that you may or may not find interesting: since objects can get lost, damaged or stolen, I got a tattoo of my partner's initials on the inner side of my left ring finger. It's incredibly discreet, I'm the only one to see it and he's literally part of my body in a way, forever. Plus, I had the tattoo artist copy his handwriting from one of the poems he had written for me, so that's an extra element that makes it even more intimate. And I can always wear a ring with that if I want.

So many things you said here resonate with me, it's uncanny! I waver between all of the scenarios you presented re: visitation or lack thereof. Sometimes I do wonder if it means they have just ceased to exist completely, but that is such a hard idea to accept. I'm not sure if this is helpful or not (the last thing I want to do is offer some cheesy platitude, we get enough of those as it is)... but a counselor I spoke with said that it was her belief that in the beginning, the first few months, that our grief is too raw to allow us to experience signs or visitation dreams. That even if they are trying to reach out to us, we may be too upset to accept or process their messages. Whether that is true or not, I have no idea, but it is something I've pondered. Last night was the first time I experienced an extremely realistic dream, so realistic that I've actually been very shaken over it all day. But it has given me something to at least be hopeful for, that maybe it will happen again tonight or sometime, anytime, again. 

Not that anything about this is funny, but I can almost laugh about what you're saying re: the exaggerated reactions and being told how beautiful we look. It's like they they think a superficial compliment will somehow help? Am I crazy for NOT wanting to look nice, because why would I anymore? My makeup itself bothers me, just seeing the brushes and eyeshadow palettes... they remind me too much of getting ready in OUR bathroom, him shaving and brushing his teeth while I'd do my makeup and hair. The fact that my toiletries are in a guest bathroom at my parents house, instead of in the drawers and cabinets back HOME where they're supposed to be, is just a punch in the gut. 

Last coincidence (and I'm sorry for the long reply) is that I am indeed planning to get a tattoo in his honor! Although up until now, I've been thinking of placing it on my ribcage. I am either doing his full name or his signature, which I have on a piece of paper to bring to the parlor to be copied. I haven't decided on that just yet. Maybe I will find a way to incoperate both. His signature is somewhat messy (I love it of course), and just initials, so I think I would like to do his full name in another script as well. 

All that said, thank you for your thoughtful reply. It is a comfort to talk with someone who understands, but I genuinely wish for your sake, that you didn't. I hate that we are all here for such similar reasons. 

[FirstWasLast]

30 minutes ago, AshleyDonahue said:

A counselor I spoke with said that it was her belief that in the beginning, the first few months, that our grief is too raw to allow us to experience signs or visitation dreams.

Absolutely, it's one of the responses I got. Here's that topic I told you about, maybe you'll find answers that will help you:

Quote

My makeup itself bothers me, just seeing the brushes and eyeshadow palettes... they remind me too much of getting ready in OUR bathroom, him shaving and brushing his teeth while I'd do my makeup and hair.

I know exactly what you mean... Before meeting my partner, I really liked wearing very bright lipstick, the kind that doesn't let you kiss, eat or drink properly. Once we got together and since I could get enough of his kisses, I stopped wearing lipstick and I admit that I was missing it occasionally. Now, I'm again free to wear all the lipstick I want but it's a freedom I wish I didn't have. It just doesn't matter anymore.

Quote

All that said, thank you for your thoughtful reply. It is a comfort to talk with someone who understands, but I genuinely wish for your sake, that you didn't. I hate that we are all here for such similar reasons. 

Thank you too for your replies. It is indeed comforting to communicate with people who actually know what I'm going through. When it all happened, I felt so alone in the universe, like no one could understand. Seeing that I'm not alone allows me to seek the answers I so desperately need, but you're right. I too wish that we'd never have to exchange these messages...

[AlwaysDee]

4 hours ago, Djh0901kc said:

I also can't stand hearing that it was my wife's time. The day before her 35th birthday? No. Sorry. It wasn't her time. I'll never buy that.

 

3 hours ago, FirstWasLast said:

The day before her birthday? Gosh, that's violent... My partner died 3 days before my birthday. Safe to say I won't be celebrating it ever again.

 

3 hours ago, KMB said:

Same here. My husband passed 3 weeks before my birthday. He was planning on us going out to dinner.  What he did for me every year. He didn't plan on dying, that I know for sure. Last year, I didn't remember it was my birthday until later that night and I cried because he wasn't here for me. This year will be no different.

I hate all of this.... why these times? none of it makes sense to me... I lost John 2 months after our wedding, a month after his 29th birthday, a few weeks after my birthday and the day after my moms birthday. I have this whole chunk of days that were supposed to be so special, and now I feel like next year, I'll have ignore the whole months of May-July....

[AlwaysDee]

2 hours ago, AshleyDonahue said:

I am in the same boat right now, I have really been struggling lately with whether or not he can see me... not to go too far off-topic with religion, but I have such a hard time trying to reconcile the concept of awareness in the afterlife... I've always been told that there is no hurting or feelings of pain in heaven. And while I'd obviously like to believe that is true, and that David is not suffering at all... if that's the case, then how can he also be "with me" or watching me, and seeing me in so much pain? Because surely that would upset him, so does that mean he isn't witnessing what's going on down here in earth? Either scenario upsets me, so I usually just have to push the whole thought process out of my mind.

I struggled with this too. I dont admit to thinking I know the answer, b.c I truly thing spirituality is a very personal thing that happens in your heart and your heart only, but for me, its like.. Hes with me, he can see me, hes without the hurting and feelings of pain of our world. and he can see my suffering and though it may have hurt him to see me that way here, hes so peaceful now he can just focus on trying to help me find peace. His burdens are so gone hes got all the "OK-ness" for both of us. Its not a very good explanation, but thats how ive come to feel it, at least for now...

[LoveGoli]

43 minutes ago, AlwaysDee said:

 

 

I hate all of this.... why these times? none of it makes sense to me... I lost John 2 months after our wedding, a month after his 29th birthday, a few weeks after my birthday and the day after my moms birthday. I have this whole chunk of days that were supposed to be so special, and now I feel like next year, I'll have ignore the whole months of May-July....

May and July, I hate July month now because he left me this month and May was the best month for me because its our wedding month but I will ignore this month now. After 2 month of our wedding anniversary I lost him. 6th is my birth date but Goli left me on 6th of july  medically (however I last see him at 5th so I count 5th is last date) so I hate my birth date too.

[TooDevastated]

Like many of you have said, my friends have been comparing what I'm going through with their breakup stories... which is just unbelivable.

I have heard my mum also say "you'll find a better one". Better meaning more 'accomplished' and better-looking and younger in her definition. She just wont get that I lost THE ONE. There is nothing to find anymore...

I have heard people say "you have to be strong and try to smile and be happy and move on with your life. Thats what he would have wanted for you" as if they knew anything about my boyfriend. 

I heard people say "You have to move on, otherwise he'll be unhappy/sad watching you sad all the time". 

These are ALL useless stupid words that well-meaning people think will help me. What I have lost is NOT replacable. I have lost my future dreams and the love of my life along with the best times of my life and my best friend. I will NOT feel better anytime soon. I wish people would just keep silent and acknowledge that they cant understand but show that they are trying to be supportive instead. 

My boyfriend also died 5 days before my birthday and he was out shopping for b'day presents the day he died. I hate my birthday now. Never plan on celebrating again.... 

[FirstWasLast]

It's unbelievable to see how many people's losses happened around the same time as birthdays and anniversaries. It just seems so cruel. I pay a lot of attention to dates in general, always have, and I must admit that being only in the first year of my grief, almost every day is a sad anniversary. Not necessarily because something particular happened on that day a year go, but simply because we were together, happy, in love and he wasn't sick yet -or at least it hadn't shown yet. I lost him in May and it's been a struggle ever since, but I particularly fear September to December, because that was an amazingly happy time period for our relationship last year, and his birthday was in December. I fear that this year, the loneliness and pain during these months will be crushing. I also fear January through May, because that's when we found out he was sick and this time period will be full of hospital and sickness memories. Bottom line is, I have no idea how I'm going to get through this year...

[LoveGoli]

19 minutes ago, FirstWasLast said:

It's unbelievable to see how many people's losses happened around the same time as birthdays and anniversaries. It just seems so cruel. I pay a lot of attention to dates in general, always have, and I must admit that being only in the first year of my grief, almost every day is a sad anniversary. Not necessarily because something particular happened on that day a year go, but simply because we were together, happy, in love and he wasn't sick yet -or at least it hadn't shown yet. I lost him in May and it's been a struggle ever since, but I particularly fear September to December, because that was an amazingly happy time period for our relationship last year, and his birthday was in December. I fear that this year, the loneliness and pain during these months will be crushing. I also fear January through May, because that's when we found out he was sick and this time period will be full of hospital and sickness memories. Bottom line is, I have no idea how I'm going to get through this year...

My Jan to May memories are also full of hospital memories because in may we found that he had rare decease but after May 14 to june 30th he was recovering very well but then July came and snatched everything from me, I still can't believe that Chickenpox which I thought a mild decease can kill someone.

[KayC]

Marty Tousley (author) is a professional grief counselor that runs a grief site, she is the one that has taught me so much about grief!  I can easily say she is my mentor.  She has not lost a husband, but she has lost a child and her dogs. 

[KayC]

15 hours ago, AlwaysDee said:

the cliches get me...

I think they should be illegal!

[KayC]

14 hours ago, Djh0901kc said:

I also can't stand hearing that it was my wife's time. The day before her 35th birthday? No. Sorry. It wasn't her time. I'll never buy that.

This is one of the ones that really bothered me!  My husband just had his 51st birthday...had he died at 34 we never would have met!  How can they say it was their time to go!  How would they like it if we said that to them when THEIR spouse died!  I'm not cruel enough to do that.

My husband never got to meet his grandchild.  He never got to retire.  We never got to take that "back way" trip to his hometown.  We had so much living to do yet!
I don't buy the "everything happens for a reason", some things that happen are just plain horrible.

[KayC]

14 hours ago, FirstWasLast said:

You know how when people see you or call you and automatically ask -without thinking, obviously- ''hi, how are you doing?''.

I learned to say, "As well as can be expected."  That seemed to acknowledge my grief without unduly upsetting them.  They usually choose to ignore that comment and get away.  Boy does death make people uncomfortable!  What they don't get though is that this is our everyday existence now!  We CAN'T get away from it!

[Eagle-96]

"Are you gonna stay in touch with Lori's family"

Are you serious? This came from Lori's cousin that I had met a few times and we weren't that close with. He knew I was close with Lori's brother and sister and their families but he just matter-of-factly asked if I would keep in touch as if they were some people I had just met at the mall. Now I know why Lori's dad thought he was an idiot. 

"You are so young(45). It would be a shame if you spent the rest of your life alone"

This came from my cousin who had lost her husband 2 1/2 years ago. I know she meant well but it goes to show you that even those who have felt this pain can say the wrong things sometimes. I have no intention of meeting anyone else. I had the relationship I dreamed of with Lori for fourteen years. It's hard to improve on perfection.

"The stress you gave Lori caused her heart attack. You did this!"

Well that couldn't be further from the truth. Everyone that knew Lori and I and our marriage knows that this was not the case. Not by a longshot. We probably had the most stress-free relationship on Earth. The comment came from Lori's mom. She has dementia issues that are getting worse and worse and they cause outbursts of anger and rage. I know the comment came from those issues but it still hurt more than anything I have heard in a long time. 

[FirstWasLast]

1 hour ago, KayC said:

I don't buy the "everything happens for a reason", some things that happen are just plain horrible.

My feelings exactly. 

[FirstWasLast]

32 minutes ago, Eagle-96 said:

"The stress you gave Lori caused her heart attack. You did this!"

WHAT??? Dementia maybe explains that accusation, but the pain it causes is just the same! I can't believe you had to go through this, I'm so sorry.

[Eagle-96]

36 minutes ago, FirstWasLast said:

WHAT??? Dementia maybe explains that accusation, but the pain it causes is just the same! I can't believe you had to go through this, I'm so sorry.

Lori and her sister had to deal with her mom's outbursts for a while. I would listen on speaker phone at what they had to endure sometimes. She could say some pretty mean things. But I had never been the recipient of any outbursts. She could be as sweet as Tupelo honey one minute and as mean as a viper the next. 99% of the conversations would be fine but that 1% was a doozie. No rhyme or reason to the episodes. It was so very hard to hear her say that to me but I know in my heart it wasn't true. This grief stew is pretty hard to swallow sometimes. Especially when people keep throwing poison in the pot.