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Jeff In Denver

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Jeff In Denver

I have mentioned this before, and I bet you have had a similar experience.  My next door neighbor knew my girlfriend very well.  The sicker she got, the more distant she became, though. I'm not surprised by that, as she strikes me as a fair weather type.  She didn't have a boyfriend then, but she now she lives with a guy.  The only time I see her is in passing. The other day she asked how I was doing and she later sent me an email: "Come over and have a beer soon and we'll chat."  What kind of invitation is that???  It's not. "What are you doing at 7:00 on Friday night? Would you like to come over?" - means a hell of a lot more.    In the 7.5 months since this happened, I have only talked to her once alone.  It would mean a lot to me to sit down and tell her what I'm feeling.

Tomorrow at least I talk with a psychologist. I feel bad for the people who can't let out some of this pressure through talk.

I have a realtor friend who recently got married.  She invited me to visit her today and then  drive up to a fancy house that her husband is building in the foothills of the Rockies.  I thought we'd have a little alone time.  I needed to talk and she knows what I'm dealing with.  Nope!  The three of us went.

My father called this morning, really sounding jovial.  (He last his wife last spring, also, but doesn't seem to be affected by it).  He doesn't know that I am still struggling with this nightmare.  I just didn't feel like talking.

Anyway, just having someone listen would be so good.  But, you know what?  No one owes me anything.  No one is responsible for my happiness.  Who wants to be dragged into a conversation with a really sad person?  And they have no idea what this kind of loss is like.  How could they?  I'm not mad at them, I am just very frustrated with how this all works. 

 

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I don't know, Jeff, I think we should be able to expect our friends to be there and listen and care, it just didn't seem to work out that way for me.  I know if situations had been reversed, I'd have been there for them...and I told them that.  But to have my best friends not even show up at his funeral?  I don't get that.

I don't get your neighbor either.  I mean, 7 1/2 months and she only spoke once?  It can be frustrating for sure, I'm sorry this is your experience.

Dr. Phil always says we teach people how to treat us...if that's the case I must not be a very good teacher!

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Jeff, Speaking for myself, I can relate. I have been estranged from my mother on and off for years. She is a narcissist, a bully, very self-centered. I don't even understand how I could have been born from her. She sent me a sympathy card a month and a half after my husband passed. I never told her what happened because she quit speaking to me the previous year because I chose to get a restraining order against my brother ( long story). She found out about my husband because of the legal notice in the local paper, that is required when a will is being processed. In her card, a little piece of paper, which said, you know he had health problems and was going to die. it made me physically sick when I read that and I threw that card and note into our burn barrel and gave it what it deserved. Yesterday afternoon, the phone rang and I recognized the home phone #. I debated for several rings on answering, but considering the rest of the family, I answered. My mother, wanting to relay the news that one of my sisters sustained a fall, a serious one that fractured a knee and caused blood clots in her lungs. I couldn't visit her this weekend due to her being kept sedated from not wanting to stay in the hospital. She has a phobia connected to doctors, etc. My mother finally gets around to asking about me and how am I doing. I could not get a single word out. Just like usual, being the narcissist, she launches in about all of her problems. She needs a knee replacement, needs a lot of dental work before she can have the knee surgery. How she can't afford to have any of this done. Then comes the big one, how am I set up financially? My mother at her finest, trying to benefit financially from my husband not being here. She knows he owned 160 acres, which transferred over to me. There are no money trees out there. I ended the call. She is 78, going strong and will never change. She is my mother, I should be getting comfort and support from her. This is why in some of my posts I mention having very little support, I truly don't. Why did my husband, who was so kind, giving, helpful to others, have to leave this life too soon and someone like my mother still here?

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Oh KMB, I am so sorry!  To have to deal with that on top of what you are already going through...that's just too much.  I think it was best you ended the call.  Sometimes we have to protect ourselves.

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I've been trying to protect myself from my own dysfunctional family for years. Maybe I should consider my father fortunate to have passed away when I was 5.

Can't pick your family but because of family, I have been trying to reconcile over and over. It's not me, it's them. But am afraid of this dysfunction causing me karma that might not be good for my soul. I'm always in a quandary about should I or should I not forgive? I can forgive my family in my heart but is that going to be good enough for God when I cross over?

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Jeff In Denver

KayC, that's pretty bad that your best friends didn't show up.  Did they ever explain why?  I can kind of see what Dr. Phil means, but only to a point.  There is no way that you are at fault in this case.  You shouldn't have to go the extra mile to get people to treat you right.  That was completely on them - not you.

KMB, I can't imagine what you had to deal with, on top of everything else.  I'm just really sorry to hear that.  Unbelievable!

My neighbor is basically a phony.  When I do see her, she'll say stuff like: "She was a fiesty and beautiful girl!"  That does nothing.  Her mother died a number of years ago and she was a total mess for a long time, but we listened to her.

 

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I could not have gotten through losing my darling without my bff. She has been and still is my rock throughout all what I have been dealing with since I lost my darling. Sometimes though I think she is so eager for me to be "back to normal " but I know that's more for her than me. We went to dinner tonight and she said eventually I should be open to at least meeting someone. I know she means well but I know I don't ever want that for myself. No man could ever come close to ever step into my darling's shoes. I will never stop loving him. I miss him so much. I love him so much. Right now I'm aching for him. I just wish I could tell him once more how much I love him. 

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I have a few neighbors that were wonderful (mowing my lawn weekly until it snowed and such) and quite a few who just sort of quit talking to us.  They were all friendly before.  It has been odd.

My kid had the worst of it with a couple kids across the street.  They told her it wasn't a big deal that her dad died and she needed to get over it.  This was about 1 or 2 weeks after he passed away.  I didn't have the energy to confront the family so we just didn't talk to them for months.  

I guess I have had it luckier than most.  People seem to still check in on me every now and again.  My youngest mentioned that we get invited to do more things with people we know than before. I think a big part of this is that every Thursday I post something on FB about my husband. I try to make it semi uplifting and not super personal, but I just don't want him forgotten.  Last week my post was about his favorite hockey team and player and why he liked them and going to a few games and such.  The week before it was his love for medicine and his hero in medicine which is why he got into it.  My husband was still in school when he passed (he was a dreamer so it was his third career change---he always excelled at his work, but his drive to learn something new and help more people kept him evolving).

Anyway, everyone's life has gone on while ours has stopped, but I won't allow him to be forgotten.  Not fully.  He was too wonderful.

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soundmankeysman1

Living in the country, my neighbors cut, split, and stacked 4 cords of firewood for us when my wife was sick this summer.  Most people don't go through what we're going through, and they don't know what to say, what to do.  And then there are people who do. 

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Jeff In Denver
47 minutes ago, Nads said:

I could not have gotten through losing my darling without my bff. She has been and still is my rock throughout all what I have been dealing with since I lost my darling. Sometimes though I think she is so eager for me to be "back to normal " but I know that's more for her than me. We went to dinner tonight and she said eventually I should be open to at least meeting someone. I know she means well but I know I don't ever want that for myself. No man could ever come close to ever step into my darling's shoes. I will never stop loving him. I miss him so much. I love him so much. Right now I'm aching for him. I just wish I could tell him once more how much I love him. 

Nads, I don't know how you feel about this, but I keep reading that if you tell him you love him, he might hear you.  (I would have laughed at that notion a year ago).

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claribassist13

Jeff, 

The sad reality is that most people simply don't know what to do. In addition to that, they have the luxury of going on with their lives. 

We don't have such a luxury, and if you are younger, your friends simply don't have the life experience to help you either. 
For example, in being 21 I can't rely on any of my friends to support me. Most of them are just beginning long-term relationships or just getting engaged. They are beginning their lives. My fiance's death has made me so much older in comparison. 
They don't know how to support me, so they do the best they can. It often ends up hurting me, but they try. 

Sometimes, people aren't equipped to be the type of friend that weathers storms. They are the "fair weather" people, as you called them. 

Don't be afraid to reach out to people if you need them. Yeah, they don't owe you anything, but if they care then they will make every attempt to try. 

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It really sucks when people just pretend it didn't happen, when they don't show up to the funeral...there are some people that just evaporate when something terrible happens.  Those people have NO character in my opinion.

The other thing I've found really hard...is when people who DID reach out, who cared...when they go back to their lives.  And I just stand still, hurting so much.  Alone.

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13 hours ago, KMB said:

should I or should I not forgive? I can forgive my family in my heart but is that going to be good enough for God when I cross over?

Yes, it's good enough.  I came from a dysfunctional family too, my mom was mentally ill and abusive and my father an alcoholic.  How us kids turned out is a miracle!  Thankfully, I've always had my sisters, we've been there for each other our whole lives and I credit them a lot for my self esteem because without them God knows where I'd be.

Forgiveness doesn't mean what they did was okay.  Boundaries are still needed.  You still have to protect yourself.  Forgiveness just means you turn them over to God and let it be between Him and them.  You let go of it, don't let it continue to have power or sway over you.  Forgiveness is for YOU not them because they may not ask for it, may not realize it, may not care about it, and may never change.  But it changes something in US, so that's reason enough to do it, it releases us from their grasp actually.  The power of forgiveness is amazing!

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12 hours ago, Jeff In Denver said:

KayC, that's pretty bad that your best friends didn't show up.  Did they ever explain why?  I can kind of see what Dr. Phil means, but only to a point.  There is no way that you are at fault in this case.  You shouldn't have to go the extra mile to get people to treat you right.  That was completely on them - not you.

I think what Dr. Phil is saying is right, when you read his book it expounds more, but basically we have to set boundaries.  In my case, I've let these "friends" go.  I realize we all have different sets of expectations when it comes to friends and when they don't line up, it's a mismatch.  Some are okay with friends that get together and have a drink.  Others want friends that will be there for them, help them move.  In my case, I guess my expectation that they be there when my husband died didn't line up with their fair weather friend status.  One chose to go to the coast instead of his funeral (she made the plans AFTER the funeral date/time was conveyed to her).  The other gave some lame excuse about she was afraid my neighbor would be there (she wasn't) and she didn't like her.  ???!!!  They both lost their friend status with me!  I didn't even get an apology from them when I explained to them how disappointed and hurt I was by their actions.

I expect more from my friends than that.  I am a good friend and expect the same in return.  It may mean I don't have as many but that's okay, I prefer quality over quantity.

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10 hours ago, soundmankeysman1 said:

Living in the country, my neighbors cut, split, and stacked 4 cords of firewood for us when my wife was sick this summer.  Most people don't go through what we're going through, and they don't know what to say, what to do.

And it's up to us to tell them what we need.  When people haven't been through something they don't understand and we have to let them know what we'd like from them.  

Claribassist makes a point:

8 hours ago, claribassist13 said:

if you are younger, your friends simply don't have the life experience to help you either. 

However, I was in my 50s and my friends did have life experience and should have known better than to just skip his funeral.  To me that's not excusable unless you're in the hospital or something.  I had been there for them as they went through divorce, etc., I would expect they would be by my side even if they didn't know what to say.

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claribassist13
7 hours ago, KayC said:

Claribassist makes a point:

However, I was in my 50s and my friends did have life experience and should have known better than to just skip his funeral.  To me that's not excusable unless you're in the hospital or something.  I had been there for them as they went through divorce, etc., I would expect they would be by my side even if they didn't know what to say.

2

KayC, that is why I made a point to not reference an age when I said "younger". I, personally, would consider younger to be 60's and below... but that is also my perspective as a relatively young person. 
Either way, it's all frustrating. 

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I don't consider 50s to be "younger" when it comes to social situations.  I would think they'd know how to be a friend by that age!  If nothing else, they could have followed my example!

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I agree with you, KayC. By the time you get into your 50's, some people have experienced loss. They should have a conscience and be there to show support. I have been in a low spot since yesterday with the snow storm that came through. Going through another one on my own sucks and is lonely.

Several years back, my husband sold his plow truck to a neighbor since we have a bobcat skidsteer that works better with deep snow. That neighbor plows out the neighborhood, the ones with no plow. We'd see him go back and forth a lot with that plow truck and occaisonally, he would stop and plow the berm in front of our driveway and maybe plow a path down our driveway. This winter, he has not gone by here once with the plow truck, even though I know he is still plowing for others. I feel totally abandoned. Some of these people we knew were always coming around to chat and ask for our help which we gladly did.

I called my oldest daughter last night out of desperation to talk to someone. She recently turned 35 and gives me her ear. Very patient and tolerant. Better than the others that don't seem to care.

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Jeff In Denver

Today a work friend stopped by my office.  He's a nice guy in his mid-50s.  He knows what happened.  Anyway, he said to me:  "Hey, you still thinking about going to Mexico this winter"?  "Did you find a new girlfriend?"

A little stunned, I said:  "Well, I don't know, I'm seeing someone, I'm not really thinking about anything beyond today.  This stuff ain't easy."

His response:  "Hey, my wife and I just booked a trip to Costa Rica!  There's a nice resort where we'll be staying, etc."

I really was dumbfounded.  Yes, I get that these people don't have any idea of what we're dealing with.  But I was floored by his reaction.  It's not unusual, and I wasn't looking for support, but this blindsided me.

 

 

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Jeff, It always blindsides us. Maybe due to the fact that our grief is internalized, not so obviously seen. We are not walking around wearings signs that say, *I'm grieving*. Or something to that effect.

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Jeff In Denver
34 minutes ago, KMB said:

Jeff, It always blindsides us. Maybe due to the fact that our grief is internalized, not so obviously seen. We are not walking around wearings signs that say, *I'm grieving*. Or something to that effect.

You're right, KMB.  It's like we're a group of people who hurt in secret.  We don't talk about what's going on, and people can't tell what we're going through.  They just assume that we're fine.  Why wouldn't they?  I'd have been the same way (before).  It just shows the stark contrast between our world and theirs.

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Jeff..I had a similar experience this week. I told my sister I went to the movies on Monday and she automatically assumed I went on a date because she said it was nice that I found a new single guy to go out with. I didn't even bother to respond to her to let her know that I went ALONE . It's not like she doesn't know that it is not even been four months since I lost my sweet husband. Some people, even family, just don't get it. 

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KMB,

I'm sorry you don't have anyone to help you with the snow, I don't either and we have another storm headed our way.  It gets old!

Jeff and Nads,

It seems we're continually hit with inappropriate remarks from people.  Sometimes I wish they'd say nothing at all than the things they do say.

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